Great news...

[JohnD]

Why negotiate then, if it's all set in stone anyway?

It's just that the Quitters have been holding out false promises of fantastic and impossible deals since before the ref, and see no signs of stopping.

Do you remember the four available options? And the quitters would never say which one they thought they were voting for?

 

[noseall]

Why negotiate then

Indeed.

 

[Doggit]

What do you mean by pushes too far

When you do a job for someone, you asses the job, and then give them a price - and some will ask when you can start, and others will say can we sit down with a cup of tea and discuss this. A good deal, is where both give a bit, and both go away happy, and a bad deal, is where one side says, this is the way it's going to go, and you can take it or leave it, and that's what Barnier Macron etc are doing to us. How do you feel when someone tells you to put two feet in one shoe.

 

[noseall]

When you do a job for someone, you asses the job, and then give them a price - and some will ask when you can start, and others will say can we sit down with a cup of tea and discuss this. A good deal, is where both give a bit, and both go away happy, and a bad deal, is where one side says, this is the way it's going to go, and you can take it or leave it, and that's what Barnier Macron etc are doing to us. How do you feel when someone tells you to put two feet in one shoe.

If someone tells me it is a 90 day payment scheme, that I have to wear PPE at all times, that I must park my vehicle in a certain direction and that there are safeguarding rules that all my workers must have complicit paperwork to - then I either obey ALL the rules or walk away. Those are the rules - take them or leave them.

The EU have had these rules for a long time and the UK have known about them too. They're not negotiating tea break times here Dogg.

 

[Doggit]

We're not talking about the existing rules Noseall, we're talking about negotiations for an ongoing trading relationship, and I can guarantee that you'd walk if you were told what to do without any justification.

And you've twisted the first paragraph, because I set the example of you doing a job for a householder, not a big company offering you work on their terms.

 

[noseall]

And you've twisted the first paragraph, because I set the example of you doing a job for a householder, not a big company offering you work on their terms.

My analogy is better.

The EU want us to abide by their rules first, THEN negotiate. So far we have agreed to pay them £45 billion - that opened a door and we (the UK government) got the message.

Quitters need to be prepared for a soft brexit and they aint gonna like it.

 

[transam]

soft brexit ? hard brexit ? will the UK be able to set there own tampon tax ??

 

[Doggit]

Yes we will; 5% at the minute, and we can set it to 0% once we leave - the EU won't allow 0% on any products at the minute.

 

[JohnD]

the EU won't allow 0% on any products at the minute.

That's not true. Have you been reading Buffoon Boris again?



Start here
https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/vat-customs/buy-sell/index_en.htm

https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/vat/eu-vat-rules-topic/exemptions_en

https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/vat/eu-vat-rules-topic/vat-rates_en
(See "exceptions to the rules")

Furthermore, a country which is a member of the EU, which has Members of the European Parliament, and the Council, and seats on the committees and membership of special interest groups, can lobby for changes to the rules.

A country which is not a member of the EU, having resigned its membership and given away its representation, has no such rights. Some countries are not members of the EU but have agreed to obey EU rules because it gives them trading or other benefits which they judge to be worthwhile.

 

[Doggit]

Reduced rates (max. 2) may be applied to a limited variety of sales and normally cannot be less than 5%.

Taken from
https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/vat-customs/buy-sell/vat-rates/index_en.htm

 

[JohnD]

Yes, as you say "normally."

What VAT rate does the UK apply to books?

What's the VAT on Jaffa Cakes?

Which country has had the right to sit on EU committees, to lobby and to vote for changes to EU rules for 40 years, and has decided to throw away that right?

 

[Doggit]

Stationary is zero rated, but I think the problem comes when a rate has been raised, it then can't be dropped back below the reduced rate, hence tampons now can't get to Zero rated under EU rules. I think it's been designed to reduce competition between member states.

 

[JohnD]

the EU won't allow 0% on any products at the minute.

False.

 

[JohnD]

As you say, the UK decided not to bother making tampons tax free, and has recently changed its mind.

What has it done to argue its case and to seek support from other EU members using the co-operative and supportive relationships it has built up over the past 40 years?

Oh yes.

I see the problem now.

 

[Notch7]

Which country has had the right to sit on EU committees, to lobby and to vote for changes to EU rules for 40 years, and has decided to throw away that right

We may have had the right for 40 years.

Thats not the same as having any influence.

Its like those that say we should stay in and lobby for reform...........