Great Political Leaders

[crystal ball]

I thought John Smith would have been a good PM

 

[Judy in the sky]

"the official figures show that some countries like Hong Kong and Mongolia have zero cases reported."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

So do you believe that Hong Kong is infinitely better than Sweden?

What's the unofficial figures then Johnny ?

 

[JohnD]

You first.


So do you believe that Hong Kong is infinitely better than Sweden?

 

[^woody^]

The fact is that Farage was correct in his statement, irrespective of the statistics have been put together.

Now that's a fact.

 

[Doggit]

You've missed the point Woody, Farage made the statement (which as you say was a correct one) but Wannabe accused him of "inventing" it. So it's a bit hypocritical to accuse someone of inventing face news, when that what they are doing themselves.

 

[^woody^]

You've missed the point Woody, Farage made the statement (which as you say was a correct one) but Wannabe accused him of "inventing" it. So it's a bit hypocritical to accuse someone of inventing face news, when that what they are doing themselves.

Que?

What point did I miss? That Farage was correct or that wannabeCOOL was not?

 

[Doggit]

The latter definitely, but it was the hypocrisy of the whole situation that I felt was more pertinent.

 

[Judy in the sky]

You first.


So do you believe that Hong Kong is infinitely better than Sweden?

Now come on, Johnny play the game, I did ask you first. It's not polite to answer a question with a question... Come on then, answer please. (before Himmy jumps in with his endless quotes)

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

I'd suggest you research what Churchill said and did during WW2 (no links for you though, just do some research please)

Only time for one quick comment tonight, I will address the other comments tomorrow, because some of them require a detailed response.
There is some evidence out there that suggests Judy is a lying, fake news perpetrator. (no links for you though, just do some research please)

Do not forget about the moon landings (no links for you though, just do some research please).

What about the Kennedy assassination. (no links for you though, just do some research please).

Then there is the alien they found (Roswell) (no links for you though, just do some research please)

Superman was real. (no links for you though, just do some research please).

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

Fake news is somebody reporting something that knowingly is untrue. Sweden getting reported as the rape capital of the world (etc etc) is poor reporting of unchecked facts, which may or may not be true, so Farage can't be accused of inventing fake news, and to accuse him of doing that, is in fact, fake news.

Farage said, "

"Sweden has taken in more young male migrants than any other country in Europe and there has been a dramatic rise in sexual crime in Sweden.
"So much so, that Malmo is now the rape capital of Europe, and some argue that perhaps it is the rape capital of the world."

http://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/nigel-farage/nigel-farage-malmo-sweden-rape-capital-of-europe/
Note that is from LBC, the station that originally broadcast the comment.

Who invented this story, Trump or Farage?
Trump referred to immigration in Sweden:

My statement as to what's happening in Sweden was in reference to a story that was broadcast on FoxNews concerning immigrants & Sweden.

http://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/politics/2017/february/president-trump-explains-sweden-incident-in-tweet

Evidently Trump never mentioned rape or any other sexual offences, Trump never mentioned a rise in crime, nor anything dramatic. In fact Trump never even mentioned crime. He did not mention Malmo. He did not mention anything about Sweden/Malmo being the rape capital.

Was there a recent dramatic rise in sex crimes in Sweden or Malmo? Absolutely not! In fact there was a decrease:

During 2015, the year in which Sweden took the largest number of asylum seekers, the number of reported sex crimes and rapes actually decreased by 11% and 12% respectively compared with 2014

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39056786
Is Farge's claim fake news? Yes. Absolutely!

Farage attributed the rise to immigration.
There has been a rise in sex offences in Sweden due to a change in legislation, when all sorts of other crimes were included in the category, such as paying for sex. (Only France, Sweden, Norway, Iceland and NI make the buying of sex illegal). This rise occurred following changes in legislation 2003 and 2013. (I will deal with other anomalies in response to woody.) The rise did not occur in the years aligned with immigration.
Is Farage's claim fake news? Yes, absolutely.


So who invented fake news about Sweden's dramatic rise in sexual crime, and attributing it to immigrants? Farage!

The outstanding question about Malmo, I will deal with in response to woody.

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

Mr Farage said ........
Sweden had seen a dramatic rise in sexual crime and its southern port city of Malmo - the third largest city in the country - had become Europe's and possibly the world's "rape capital".

BBC News said .......
"Reality Check verdict: Malmo, along with other urban centres in Sweden, has one of the highest levels of reported rapes in proportion to population in the EU, mainly due to the strictness of Swedish laws and how rape is recorded in the country."

"The 2012 UN international rape rate comparison showed Sweden to have the highest rate of rape in Europe and the second highest in the world"

You are insisting on addressing a different discussion, one that you want to address, not the one of my original point about there not being a dramatic rise in sex crime in Sweden, or it being attributable to immigrants.

Nevertheless, as you refuse to, or are incapable of addressing my points, I will address yours.

As Noseall, and John have eloquently explained, but you refuse to accept, Sweden's criminal and legal systems differ very much, on the subject of sex crimes,to other countries. It has been explained to you twice already, but I will remind you, UN, EU and many other legitimate and authenticated organisations argue that you cannot compare reported crimes between different countries because of their different criminal and legal systems.
For instance, where do you think is the kidnapping capital of the world? Mexico (drug wars, poverty?), India (forced marriage?) Somalia (piracy?), Afghanistan/Pakistan (rendition?), Syria (ISIS)?
You may be surprised to learn (I was!) that Australia and Canada are the kidnapping capitals of the world.
How come you may ask?

Which two countries are the kidnapping capitals of the world?
Australia and Canada.
Official figures from the United Nations show that there were 17 kidnaps per 100,000 people in Australia in 2010 and 12.7 in Canada.
That compares with only 0.6 in Colombia and 1.1 in Mexico.
So why haven't we heard any of these horror stories? Are people being grabbed off the street in Sydney and Toronto, while the world turns a blind eye?
No, the high numbers of kidnapping cases in these two countries are explained by the fact that parental disputes over child custody are included in the figures.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372
In another example rape in Wales and England (NI and Scotland are different, such are the glaring discrepancies) only males can rape, and then it has to be penile penetration. Anything outside of those narrow confines is considered a different offence. In Sweden passive acquiescence, by the victim, can be considered as rape. (e.g. while the victim is asleep, or does not verbally object, etc)
You see how different legal definitions and criminal systems can skew the results. The same has happened with sex crimes (especially rape) in Sweden.

The there are the cultural differences. In most places women don’t feel very comfortable reporting rape. They would rather the attacker go free than feel the embarrassment of the whole world knowing that they have been raped. This is not so in Sweden. Females feel comfortable about reporting rape in Sweden.

Finally, your belief in Farage's claim that Malmo is Europe's rape capital.

It becomes blindingly obvious that in two years only, and then only marginally, (2008 and 2010) Malmo's number of reported rapes were the highest in Sweden. In the other eight out of ten years, Gothenburg or Stockholm have seen more cases of reported rape then Malmo.
So Farage's claim was utterly false, deceitful, dishonest and fake news!

Furthermore, when considering Sweden or Malmo as the rape capital of the world, South Africa's is considered to be double that of Sweden, but there are other countries that do not or cannot provide data.
So again Farage's claim was intentionally misleading.

 

[^woody^]

Your OP referenced the BBC site which stated one set of facts, and now you have browsed the web for other facts to contradict the ones you first posted.

Not so much fake post news but confused post news.

And still Farage was correct in regards to his comments on Malmö.

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

Your OP referenced the BBC site which stated one set of facts, and now you have browsed the web for other facts to contradict the ones you first posted.

Not so much fake post news but confused post news.

And still Farage was correct in regards to his comments on Malmö.

Vague baseless accusations, (again) woody. I thought you were better than this.
It seems I overestimated you.
Your ideas (and Farage's) have been robustly rebutted, yet you continue to bluff and bluster.

You know, (you obviously do not, like Farage) when one makes a mistake, the best course of action is to admit it, own up to it, apologise if you have offended anyone, then we can all move on and it is forgotten about. Usually respect is earned in admitting your mistake.
Not you, not Farage, you prefer to continue to make vague unsupportable accusations and claims because you do not have the good sense or the balls to recognise when you are wrong.

 

[^woody^]

apologise if you have offended anyone

Have the facts offended you? You poor thing. Man up.

Meanwhile, in Malmö, the undisputed rape capital of Europe, the crime wave continues.

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

Have the facts offended you? You poor thing. Man up.

Meanwhile, in Malmö, the undisputed rape capital of Europe, the crime wave continues.

You are resorting to blatant and extreme trolling now.
As I said, when you do not have the courage to admit your mistake, or the capacity to debate intelligently, you resort to vague accusations, bluster and insults.