Hate campaign and incompetent police

[Himaginn]

We have been told by a third party that legal aid will not be given for my daughters appeal, because her own solicitor has advised her against making one on the grounds that the punishment was so light.

The danger of an appeal is that the sentence can be increased because crown courts have the ability to impose greater sentences than magistrates courts.

Sometimes, it can be beneficial to suffer indignities and walk away, than to continue to fight a possible unwinnable contest.
It is sometimes beneficial to one's own health to accept decisions, even though you consider them unfair, than to allow them to fester.

 

[ajstoneservices]

People still have the right to choose to be tried in a crown court.

Not true. https://www.judiciary.gov.uk/you-and-the-judiciary/going-to-court/magistrates-court/

 

[Himaginn]

That is the question.
I am entirely confident on that, I have questioned my daughter at length about it on numerous occasions. She has an incredible memory and she says that as the police constable was questioning her at her interview, he was putting events to her taken from the witness statements of the complainant and her friend.
She was correcting him from her own memory and did so on a number of occasions, one of the points was the baby on the knee I have mentioned. Another thing they said was that my daughter walked around the complainants friend and past the complainant to go back to her table, and it was as she did so they say she struck the blow. My daughters table was behind and to the side of her as she faced the complainant, and she did not walk round or past them to go back to it. In fact her partner had heard the commotion and went across to my daughter, she was shouting at the complainant who had been very provocative, and he says he had his arms around her with her arms down at her side as he pulled her away. My daughter says that the CCTV footage she was shown was clear enough to make all of this out and it proved what she said was right.

Did this incident occur in some type of formal interview?
How come there was CCTV coverage? Was it a public space?

 

[Himaginn]

Not true. https://www.judiciary.gov.uk/you-and-the-judiciary/going-to-court/magistrates-court/

Yeah, OK, I was thinking in terms of criminal prosecutions and convictions. Motoring and other summary offences do not necessarily incur criminal convictions.
You are, pedantically, correct.

Incidentally, sooey, a conditional discharge is not a criminal conviction. A breach of that conditional discharge is a potential criminal conviction.

 

[sooey]

The danger of an appeal is that the sentence can be increased because crown courts have the ability to impose greater sentences than magistrates courts.

We are aware of that.

It is sometimes beneficial to one's own health to accept decisions, even though you consider them unfair, than to allow them to fester.

This is not just unfair. It is wrong, it is a malicious case brought about by two people who hate my daughter, and who have engineered a confrontational situation between her and a third party, when that situation resulted in a huge argument they would have been within their rights to accuse her of causing an affray. But that wasn't enough,they then got the third party and her friend to lie about a blow being struck and got another person to lie as well, all done to get an innocent girl convicted of assault and given a criminal record.
That is what would fester if allowed to stand.
I will be seeing the police later today in the full knowledge of how serious the allegations I am about to make against these people are, and in the full knowledge of the serious repercussions that could befall me for making them if I am lying or just plain wrong.

 

[Himaginn]

and given a criminal record.

Incidentally, sooey, a conditional discharge is not a criminal conviction. A breach of that conditional discharge is a potential criminal conviction.

 

[sooey]

Did this incident occur in some type of formal interview?
How come there was CCTV coverage? Was it a public space?

Yes, it was a public space. It was an indoor children's play facility, which luckily was covered by CCTV.
My daughter was there because it was her eldest sons 8th birthday and that was his favourite place.
She had been there on his 7th birthday and had taken the complainant with her on that occasion.
She is a very shy vulnerable girl who hates being in public, and who is highly ashamed of the way that she reacted to the complainants vile provocation on the day, and in a childrens play area.
She said as much to the police during her interview, but when the provocation she received is looked at in context to the hate campaign that was and is going on, it becomes more understandable.

 

[sooey]

Incidentally, sooey, a conditional discharge is not a criminal conviction. A breach of that conditional discharge is a potential criminal conviction.

It is still a criminal record, and in the meantime the perpetrators of this affair have 12 months to think of something else they can do to make the situation worse for her.

 

[Himaginn]

It is still a criminal record, and in the meantime the perpetrators of this affair have 12 months to think of something else they can do to make the situation worse for her.

I believe it's only a criminal record for the duration of the conditional discharge. Once the conditional time limit has been completed, it is no longer a criminal record.

Hmm, might be plus one year after the conditional time limit is spent.

Certain convictions are deemed “spent” under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 after the following periods of time (known as the “rehabilitation period” – the period is halved where the offender was under 18 at the point they were convicted)

• Conditional discharge – 1 year post conviction or 1 year post cessation of order, whichever is the longer

• http://www.inbrief.co.uk/court-judgements/criminal-records/

 

[sooey]

Thanks for that, even so, I am/was under the impression that if in future she ever had to appear in a court those records may still be brought up.
If that's not the case then at least that's something.
Not that she has any intention of ever appearing in court again obviously, but you never know what the future may hold.

 

[Himaginn]

Thanks for that, even so, I am/was under the impression that if in future she ever had to appear in a court those records may still be brought up.
If that's not the case then at least that's something.
Not that she has any intention of ever appearing in court again obviously, but you never know what the future may hold.

The time limits mentioned are for 'spent' convictions which means that she does not have to declare them and they cannot influence her career, etc.
I think they could only be used in court for a similar type of prosecution in the future. But she would discuss that with her solicitor at that possible future time.

 

[sooey]

OK, today I spoke to a decent copper who knows some of the history ref. the family feud that is going on.
He was on desk duty and got called away to deal with some other matter during our talk, though I left my contact number for him to get back to me.
If that doesn't happen I will then go in and make a formal written complaint detailing my allegations. With that in mind I have written a first draft. So please, anyone interested have a read, see what you think, any improvements? I'm not great with words and I want to try to ensure that they take me seriously and actually investigate this. I have changed the names and omitted place and road names.


I ******* *** of *** ********* ** ****** allege that Joan and John Smith of ** ********* ***** ****** conspired with 2 others to engineer a confrontational situation on 21 February 2016, this led to a heated argument in a public place between my daughter Christine Cambell and the 2 others, Namely Martha Johnson of ** ********* ***** ****** and Daisy Jones.of *******.
Johnson was deliberately very provocative to my daughter, and Johnson and Jones then made a malicious and wrong complaint to police that my daughter had struck Johnson during the ensuing argument.
The Smith's then somehow persuaded another party who was a witness to the scene namely Mary Poppins of ******* to lie in order to corroborate Johnson and Jones' version of events.
These malicious and wicked lies by 3 different people, arranged and facilitated at every stage by the Smiths resulted in my daughter being wrongly charged with assault and subsequently wrongly convicted, and given a conditional discharge.
Being in a public place there was CCTV footage which captured the whole incident and was subsequently viewed by my daughter. This footage bore out my daughters memories of the event and disproved the lies that were being told in court.
This footage was not used but is in existence and can be viewed by police. The other huge mistake that the Smiths have made was to involve the young witness Mary Poppins in their scheme, this young girl held herself together well in court as she was lying to the district judge. But the second she got through the courtroom door after giving her testimony she went into complete meltdown, bawling and crying uncontrollably and having to be supported out by her mother. This was seen by me and the court usher, and this girl, if questioned by the police would very soon admit her lies, and tell of the involvement of the Smiths in this affair if questioned along those lines. Especially so if she was made aware of the prospect of repeating her "evidence" before a crown court judge at the appeal.
These 5 people between them have conspired and colluded to commit a criminal act which resulted in a gross perversion of the course of justice, and in my opinion this can easily be uncovered by a police investigation. The CCTV footage of the incident and the tape recording of my daughters interview with the police will expose the lies told and emphasised by the witnesses. And a police interview with the young girl Mary Poppins should quickly uncover the truth also.
I make these accusations against these 5 people in the full knowledge of the serious consequences that could befall them, and consequently in the full knowledge of the serious consequences that could befall me if I am found to be wrong or making malicious allegations of my own. I require the police service to now investigate this case as a matter of urgency, and get these people their just desserts as well as justice for my innocent daughter.
I have much more background information to provide and can be contacted on *** ****
Thank You

* ***

 

[EFLImpudence]

serious consequences that could befall me if I am wrong or lying. I require

I would leave out "or lying".

Could you mention that if the CCTV had shown your daughter doing it, it would surely have been entered as evidence against her?

 

[sooey]

Edited, does that read better? Ta!


Good point about the CCTV, will bring that up when I talk to them.
But need to try and keep this opener as short as possible.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, seems fine.