Help appreciated with Ethernet cable / Second router
- Thread starter Ray1000
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Hubs broadcast packets of info to all of the connected devices. A switch only sends it to the device intended. That is a massive simplification but hubs invariably generate more traffic than is necessary (and accordingly, slow down throughput).
The broadband supplier calls my thing a hub (Virgin Media Hub 4). It also has a phone socket, a TV coax, and provides WiFi. It has a password. I get about 100Mbps on a wired device.
So I just want something I can put upstairs, plugged into one of the "hub" sockets. Preferably that can provide another WiFi.
So I just want something I can put upstairs, plugged into one of the "hub" sockets. Preferably that can provide another WiFi.
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You didn't try typing "gigabit switch" into eBay and looking for a cheap one?
OK
"Hub" is a problematic word in networking; back when Ethernet networks were quite primitive hubs were common. As opps said they would receive a message on one port and blat it out to all other ports. Ethernet devices like computers generally pick up only messages intended for them (bearing their address) and ignore others, so it doesn't matter if hubs blat out messages to everywhere because the filtering was largely done on the devices connected to the hub, but it fills up a network with a lot of useless messaging.
An analogy might be if you posted a letter to your friend and the local postman photocopied it 5000 times and left a copy at every house in the village. 4999 people put it in the recycling because it wasn't addressed to them and 1 opened it and read it
Nowadays we have switches, which are slightly more intelligent in that they learn the addresses of things connected to them and they can send arriving packets to ports based on the packet's address, so they generally only send packets to ports where they will eventually be picked up. This means that multiple devices can communicate more like directly, without flooding the rest of the network. An analogy is much closer to how the actual postal system operates
"Switch" as a word is like "switchboard" in old telephone nomenclature, but most people think more of like a light switch so it's not a good word for marketing departments to describe networking gear even though it it technically correct among networking nerds
Virgin choose to call your router/media center/whatever a "hub" for the marketingy fluffy "it's one place that brings everything together" meaning - it's nothing to do with a networking hub, which generally aren't sold any more
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If you want more Ethernet sockets and wifi upstairs, I would recommend you get a switch and a wireless access point (AP); you run a cable from the virgin hub to the switch, you run another cable from the switch to the PoE injector that came with the AP, and you run a third cable from PoE injector to the AP. Or you buy a switch that does PoE and connect it directly to the AP. The AP gets its power and network connection from the single network wire, but you need power on the network wire. They don't normally carry power in a home setting so that's what the PoE injector or PoE switch is for. PoE switches are more expensive than normal switches and there are different voltages of PoE so take care to match or adapt (via inline voltage changer) the requirements of the AP with the export of the switch
Example PoE injector https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/126165929570 and AP https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314922554845
You don't make "another" wifi; you create the same network ID and security settings, as it's less headache that way- your devices will roam between the different APs on the same ID/password pairing
--
You can also reuse an old ISP router for this, as long as it's wired up internally in the same way (the internal AP is connected to the internal switch) but for reasons already given in this thread I prefer dedicated kit for these things, especially when I have to tech support it
OK
TP-Link Gigabit Ethernet Switch 5 port TL-SG1005D | eBay
Works perfectly, just been tested.
www.ebay.co.uk
"Hub" is a problematic word in networking; back when Ethernet networks were quite primitive hubs were common. As opps said they would receive a message on one port and blat it out to all other ports. Ethernet devices like computers generally pick up only messages intended for them (bearing their address) and ignore others, so it doesn't matter if hubs blat out messages to everywhere because the filtering was largely done on the devices connected to the hub, but it fills up a network with a lot of useless messaging.
An analogy might be if you posted a letter to your friend and the local postman photocopied it 5000 times and left a copy at every house in the village. 4999 people put it in the recycling because it wasn't addressed to them and 1 opened it and read it
Nowadays we have switches, which are slightly more intelligent in that they learn the addresses of things connected to them and they can send arriving packets to ports based on the packet's address, so they generally only send packets to ports where they will eventually be picked up. This means that multiple devices can communicate more like directly, without flooding the rest of the network. An analogy is much closer to how the actual postal system operates
"Switch" as a word is like "switchboard" in old telephone nomenclature, but most people think more of like a light switch so it's not a good word for marketing departments to describe networking gear even though it it technically correct among networking nerds
Virgin choose to call your router/media center/whatever a "hub" for the marketingy fluffy "it's one place that brings everything together" meaning - it's nothing to do with a networking hub, which generally aren't sold any more
---
If you want more Ethernet sockets and wifi upstairs, I would recommend you get a switch and a wireless access point (AP); you run a cable from the virgin hub to the switch, you run another cable from the switch to the PoE injector that came with the AP, and you run a third cable from PoE injector to the AP. Or you buy a switch that does PoE and connect it directly to the AP. The AP gets its power and network connection from the single network wire, but you need power on the network wire. They don't normally carry power in a home setting so that's what the PoE injector or PoE switch is for. PoE switches are more expensive than normal switches and there are different voltages of PoE so take care to match or adapt (via inline voltage changer) the requirements of the AP with the export of the switch
Example PoE injector https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/126165929570 and AP https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314922554845
You don't make "another" wifi; you create the same network ID and security settings, as it's less headache that way- your devices will roam between the different APs on the same ID/password pairing
--
You can also reuse an old ISP router for this, as long as it's wired up internally in the same way (the internal AP is connected to the internal switch) but for reasons already given in this thread I prefer dedicated kit for these things, especially when I have to tech support it
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PoE is power over Ethernet, yes. That particular injector is essentially a 24v power supply becuase that's what those model of UniFi accept. Enterprise PoE is more usually 48 to 52v so it comes in different flavours. Ubiquiti did eventually flick to using a more industry standard voltage which removes the need for inline converters if you have a switch that emits "proper" PoE.
An injector plugs into an AC outlet, takes a network feed in one socket (which it passes through) and has another socket intended to go to the powered device where 24v is added to the network wire. For max neatness you'd probably plug the switch and the injector in in a cupboard, link the injector to the switch with a very short Ethernet patch cable and then use a long patch cable to go to the AP.
The socket on that AP is in a depression under the word "Winchester". That particular AP also comes with a mounting plate that is currently fitted to the AP on the wrong position (the cutout in the mounting plate pictured is at 10 o'clock. In proper service the cutout would be at 6 o'clock. Had the seller placed the plate on with the cutout at 6 before they took the picture you'd be able to see the connectors on the AP. See this listing for a better idea. To mount, one screws the plate to the wall or ceiling, plugs the connector in and them places the AP against the plate and rotates slightly to engage the locking tabs.
If the cable is buried in the wall it gives a nice, discreet finish. You can of course also chuck it in the cupboard with the switch if you're not bothered about optimum placement in a corridor
Different models of unifi APs exist with different shapes. My outdoor ones serving the garden are stick like with two positionable antennae
An injector plugs into an AC outlet, takes a network feed in one socket (which it passes through) and has another socket intended to go to the powered device where 24v is added to the network wire. For max neatness you'd probably plug the switch and the injector in in a cupboard, link the injector to the switch with a very short Ethernet patch cable and then use a long patch cable to go to the AP.
The socket on that AP is in a depression under the word "Winchester". That particular AP also comes with a mounting plate that is currently fitted to the AP on the wrong position (the cutout in the mounting plate pictured is at 10 o'clock. In proper service the cutout would be at 6 o'clock. Had the seller placed the plate on with the cutout at 6 before they took the picture you'd be able to see the connectors on the AP. See this listing for a better idea. To mount, one screws the plate to the wall or ceiling, plugs the connector in and them places the AP against the plate and rotates slightly to engage the locking tabs.
If the cable is buried in the wall it gives a nice, discreet finish. You can of course also chuck it in the cupboard with the switch if you're not bothered about optimum placement in a corridor
Different models of unifi APs exist with different shapes. My outdoor ones serving the garden are stick like with two positionable antennae
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I ran the Ethernet cable round the house and not wanting to drill from the inside outwards I went to the trouble of taking measurements thro a window on the adjacent wall and transferring them round the corner and down the side of the house ... luckily it landed in the right place. 
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I went to the trouble of taking measurements thro a window on the adjacent wall and transferring them round the corner and down the side of the house ... luckily it landed in the right place.
Impressed, or what?
Time to get a Lottery card, I think
When I get the Ethernet faceplate connected up I'm still thinking about putting a second router in that room (Office)
I have done it four times over the years at my own house but never sure it's exactly as it should be.
These are the instructions I've been using ....
Setting up a second router to extend wireless range (Bridge Mode Method)
With the PC connected via Ethernet cable to the Primary Router (R1)
Type 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin ... Password = admin
Take note of the Broadband Username xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxand Password (123456)
Take note of the Wireless username xxxxxxxxxxxx and Password (xxxxxxxx)
Set the Wireless Channel to 1 (Or your preference)
Turn the R1 off and disconnect from the PC
Connect Secondary Router (R2) to the PC via cable and turn on.
Reset to factory settings
Type 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin, Password = admin.
In Status take note of the Physical Address XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX (Mac Address)
bc:f6:85:ad:e0:da
In Advanced > Wireless Setup > Manual Setup ...
Set the Wireless Channel to something away from R1 say 6
Set the Wireless SSID username and Password - Pre-shared key - same as R1
In Advanced > setup >ADSL Setup ... WAN Choose Bridge Mode
In Basic > LAN set up > DHCP change LAN Host Setting – Router - IP address to 192.168.1.7 and check subnet mask is 255.255.255.0
Save Settings at each change
In DHCP Server on the same page disable DHCP Server
In Advanced Firewall and DMZ turn the firewall off
In Advanced LAN turn off the UPnP
Clicked submit ... the Internet connection will be lost at this point
Choose WPA and WPA2 on both routers
Slave needs default gateway same as the primary 192.168.1.1
Disconnect R2 (Secondary Router) from the PC
Connect the Primary Router (R1) to the PC
Set R2 up in its new position and connect LAN1 on R1 to LAN1 on R2
Turn both routers on.
Typed 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin ... Password = XXXXXXXX
Click Advanced Click OK
In Basic LAN > Set up > LAN Set up DCHP LAN host Settings
In IP Address choose 192.168.1.7
In MAC Address type XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX (Physical Address from line 11)
bc:f6:85:ad:e0:da fil in IP Address 192.168.1.7
In Status choose Static > Choose Add/Apply
Turn everything off > Turn everything on after a minute or so.
I happen to choose 7 in the IP address but it could be anything in the range
Some routers may not have a Bridge mode option
The routers used in this case were (R1) DLink DSL3780 and (R2) DLink DSL2680
And the second time a Huawei HG533 as primary and (R2) DLink DSL2680
And the third time a Huawei HG533 as primary and Huawei HG633 as secondary
And the Forth time a Fibe Optic TT WiFi Hub as primary and Huawei HG633 as secondary (Same in Oct 2022)
Oct 2022 Trying to add a third router
BB Username XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
BB password 123456
Is there an easier way ?
Thank you
Ray
I have done it four times over the years at my own house but never sure it's exactly as it should be.
These are the instructions I've been using ....
Setting up a second router to extend wireless range (Bridge Mode Method)
With the PC connected via Ethernet cable to the Primary Router (R1)
Type 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin ... Password = admin
Take note of the Broadband Username xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxand Password (123456)
Take note of the Wireless username xxxxxxxxxxxx and Password (xxxxxxxx)
Set the Wireless Channel to 1 (Or your preference)
Turn the R1 off and disconnect from the PC
Connect Secondary Router (R2) to the PC via cable and turn on.
Reset to factory settings
Type 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin, Password = admin.
In Status take note of the Physical Address XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX (Mac Address)
bc:f6:85:ad:e0:da
In Advanced > Wireless Setup > Manual Setup ...
Set the Wireless Channel to something away from R1 say 6
Set the Wireless SSID username and Password - Pre-shared key - same as R1
In Advanced > setup >ADSL Setup ... WAN Choose Bridge Mode
In Basic > LAN set up > DHCP change LAN Host Setting – Router - IP address to 192.168.1.7 and check subnet mask is 255.255.255.0
Save Settings at each change
In DHCP Server on the same page disable DHCP Server
In Advanced Firewall and DMZ turn the firewall off
In Advanced LAN turn off the UPnP
Clicked submit ... the Internet connection will be lost at this point
Choose WPA and WPA2 on both routers
Slave needs default gateway same as the primary 192.168.1.1
Disconnect R2 (Secondary Router) from the PC
Connect the Primary Router (R1) to the PC
Set R2 up in its new position and connect LAN1 on R1 to LAN1 on R2
Turn both routers on.
Typed 192.168.1.1 in address bar
Username = admin ... Password = XXXXXXXX
Click Advanced Click OK
In Basic LAN > Set up > LAN Set up DCHP LAN host Settings
In IP Address choose 192.168.1.7
In MAC Address type XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX (Physical Address from line 11)
bc:f6:85:ad:e0:da fil in IP Address 192.168.1.7
In Status choose Static > Choose Add/Apply
Turn everything off > Turn everything on after a minute or so.
I happen to choose 7 in the IP address but it could be anything in the range
Some routers may not have a Bridge mode option
The routers used in this case were (R1) DLink DSL3780 and (R2) DLink DSL2680
And the second time a Huawei HG533 as primary and (R2) DLink DSL2680
And the third time a Huawei HG533 as primary and Huawei HG633 as secondary
And the Forth time a Fibe Optic TT WiFi Hub as primary and Huawei HG633 as secondary (Same in Oct 2022)
Oct 2022 Trying to add a third router
BB Username XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
BB password 123456
Is there an easier way ?
Thank you
Ray
Well played.
Don't forget to loop the cable downwards (on the exterior) to prevent water running along the cable and into the house.
I’m a bit late to this thread but will share what I did at my old house for the benefit of context.
So running the Ethernet cable to another location from the main hub is the right thing.
You’ve terminated it into a RJ45 face plate from what I can see, again all good.
I’d stick a switch on the end of that and that gives you “x” number of ports to extend your network with.
if you have a 4 port switch; essentially that gives you 3 ports to work with. So you could then wire your Xbox, Laptop and perhaps a WiFi Access point, which is what I did, giving me WiFi at the bottom of the garden + that hard wired connection for gaming and work.
I know we all talk about speed but for the average home … you won’t notice a difference really, it’s in the enterprise setting that you need to really consider throughput and saturation of the links.
So running the Ethernet cable to another location from the main hub is the right thing.
You’ve terminated it into a RJ45 face plate from what I can see, again all good.
I’d stick a switch on the end of that and that gives you “x” number of ports to extend your network with.
if you have a 4 port switch; essentially that gives you 3 ports to work with. So you could then wire your Xbox, Laptop and perhaps a WiFi Access point, which is what I did, giving me WiFi at the bottom of the garden + that hard wired connection for gaming and work.
I know we all talk about speed but for the average home … you won’t notice a difference really, it’s in the enterprise setting that you need to really consider throughput and saturation of the links.
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