Ideal ConcordeWCF-255A - not firing up

[panamajack]

A retired gas fitted friend came out, did an electrical check and said it was the solenoid. For the record, power was going to it, but there was no clicking on or off. He stated what a few here have stated and that was that he has never seen a Honeywell valve with a 240 volt solenoid head and a label on the valve saying 24 volt. He is of the oppinion that the same head is used for 24volt and 240volt by just fitting a 24 volt or 240 volt head and is there just as a reference. Anyway, that said, although this is new, it is faulty. So, the seller is going to take it back and exchange it.

Thanks once again to all of you for your input, very much appreciated.


Panama Jack

 

[twgas]

I have re-wired this house when I bought it 10 years ago, so putting this valve on should have been straightforward like the one that the one I put on 15 years back and which failed a week ago.

Did you replace the valve 5 years before you moved in?

 

[doitall]

As far as I'm concerned the wrong valve was fitted last time and the wrong valve will be fitted this time.

 

[Agile]

I dont know why so many are advising an OP who is involved in DIY gas work.

According to the label its a 24v AC gas valve!

But there is probably a matching 240v AC solenoid which can also be fitted. The OP implies thats the case. Some parts sold on Ebay are not correct.

If its a 24v solenoid then it will have been blown if he connected it to 240v and that will not have blown any fuses or tripped any RCDs. It will just be open circuit.

Very unfortunately the Ebay seller will probably have suffered from having his new part damaged by the DIYer who clearly does not have sufficient knowledge to understand what he is doing.

That is why no one should have been helping or encouraging him.

There is only one safe advice to be given and thats to contact a proper registered boiler engineer who specialises in repairs!

Tony Glazier

 

[panamajack]

I appreciate your comments. I am a DIYer. Actually work as a I.T. engineer. Anyway, that said, as I my previous posts said, I fitted one of these 10/15 years ago but it died about 2 weeks ago. Fitted the new one which fired up, but after 20 seconds cut out. The solenoid has a black top which is 240 volt, if it was blue 24volt, I would have sent it back, but black it was and additionally had 240 volt on the side. It was the Honeywell barcode sticker that threw me and even a gas fitter friend of mine cos it had 24volt on the sticker.

Anyway, that said, RGI friend did a voltage test on the solenoid and it was dead. So the new valve has been sent back and a solenoid will be ordered.

Re the 24volt label, apparently this is to let fitter know (or confuse them) that it is also compatible valve for use with 240 volt or 24 volt depending on the solenoid

 

[oilhead]

All honeywell valves are easily recognised for voltage by the first number of the reference; e.g V8600 is 24volt, and V4600 is 240volt. V4700 and V8700 are the same. Basically they are the same valve with different solenoid assemblies on them. When buying gas spares, a reputable stockist will only sell to registered RGI's. This forum alleges it does not advise DIY'ers or unregistered engineers. This thread is a prime example of the blind leading the blind interspersed with some sane posters who have been ignored because the response has not been what the O.P has wanted to hear.
Purchasing anything off Ebay should be approached with caution, and anty technical parts should be avoided unless you can see the pedigree of the seller. It would seem that this particular item is a 'hybrid' that would never reach the counter of a bona fide stockist.

 

[panamajack]

thanks for your reply.

I take your point regarding some on here. I could tell by a couple of answers that some were not RGI., though I was surprised that no one said, 'just change the solenoid head as this is the only electrical part on the valve' or 'listen close to the solenoid when you switch the boiler on, if you don't hear a click, then just the solenoid is faulty'.

Regarding the gas valve itself, the one that came off it was the 8600, but with a 240volt solenoid head. This was originally bought from a supplier locally long before eBay became live. The valve before that was also the same and I can onlyt assume that was at manufacture, but again, the solenoid head was black - 240 volt. The one I bought of eBay came in the original Honeywell manufacturer's packaging, unopened. Though, I did notice that this valve was made in the Czech Republic unlike the previous one which was made in the Netherlands, obviously for costs. Maybe now they use the same valve with the same 24 volt sticker, but put the appropriate head on.

As you correctly say, the valve is essentially the same, just the solenoid that is different. I have since spoken to another RGI who has told me that a few of these valve that he has bought have the 24 volt Honeywell sticker on but with the appropriate 240 or 24 volt solenoid head on.

The main thing is that the solenoid is at fault, so all that has to be done is change this.

 

[steve32]

I take your point regarding some on here. I could tell by a couple of answers that some were not RGI., though I was surprised that no one said, 'just change the solenoid head as this is the only electrical part on the valve' or 'listen close to the solenoid when you switch the boiler on, if you don't hear a click, then just the solenoid is faulty'.

I asked you on page 1 of this thread if you had a multimeter had you had a multimeter I would have explained to you how to test the solenoid but you were fumbling about with a neon screw driver which is useless for testing. (you couldn't even tell me the correct voltage at the gas valve).
As an I.T. engineer you should have a multimeter and know how to test voltage and components.

RGI's on this site should not be advising on the gas components of an appliance.

 

[panamajack]

Sorry, you are right. I forgot about your post, been that many of them.

As an I.T. engineer, 80% of the work being software, network (mostly software support). Hardware side, I, like many engineers, carry a phillips screwdriver and one or two basic tools. Most things are not repairable, just replace, but as most of my work is sorting Microsoft's crap products, multimeter is not much use. My old one broke years ago, but never replaced it cos my work went in a different direction and never needed one since.