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Painting roof fascia boards and soffits -Access equipment? £Quote?

Discussion in 'Trade Talk' started by DMA, 16 Jun 2016.

  1. DMA

    DMA

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    IMG_20160612_195039.jpg IMG_20160612_195032.jpg IMG_20160612_195019.jpg IMG_20160612_194957.jpg IMG_20160612_194938.jpg IMG_20160612_194926.jpg

    Hello,

    I am wondering if anyone with experience can help me?

    I started painting and decorating after doing some training and recently someone asked me about painting exterior fascia boards, soffits and upstairs exterior side of the windows etc.

    I'm not sure what to charge here in the northwest and also what access equipment I can get to do it? The front of the house height is about 6.5m, width of house about 8m, length of house about 14m

    This is an access equipment kit I saw http://www.laddersrus.co.uk/eshop/product.php?xProd=253&xSec=9

    This is the stabilisers http://www.laddersrus.co.uk/eshop/product.php?xProd=36&xSec=9

    the website says they completely stabilize ladders and its impossible for the ladder to slide down or side over if positioned correctly?
     
    Last edited: 16 Jun 2016
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  3. Bosswhite

    Bosswhite

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    Hire Scaffolding. The Customer pays the cost.
     
  4. handyjack

    handyjack

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    [​IMG]
     
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  5. DMA

    DMA

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    I was thinking that if the customer hires scaffolding I would be pressured to finish the job before the scaffolding needs to be sent back and I also thought that the £400 (or what ever the cost of scaffolding hire would be) could instead be used to invest in my own access equipment that I could use again in the future.

    That pic of the ladder tied down and safety rope looks good.

    Where is the best place to buy ladders and that safety equipment?

    Thanks
     
  6. Bosswhite

    Bosswhite

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    I have found in the past that Scaffolding firms will allow extra time for their equipment due to delays for unforeseen circumstances and bad weather, its in their interest as you are more likely to go back to them at a later date, but its something that you should make your customer aware of when you quote for the job.

    Due to different styles of property you could end up wanting a large range of Access equipment, much of which may not be appropriate and will not conform to Insurance Inspections/ regulations if it fails

    At least a Scaffolding Firm will have its equipment insured ( possibly !!!!)

    Rule of thumb any work above First Floor level (Gutter Level) requires scaffolding/Platform or any works above ground floor level on a public footpath/highway requires the same, covered by Public Liability Insurance .
     
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  7. vinn

    vinn

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    OP,
    with your obviously non-existent knowledge of the trade you've chosen you want to stop right now and think things through.
    All CSCS cards include safety training. So do all college courses for the trades. Even the most basic levels wouldn't have to ask the questions that you ask.
    You have no right to chance having a paid practice on an unsuspecting customer.
    If you hurt yourself, there might go any possibility of your earning a living doing physical work, and the trusting householder might lose their home to pay your probably uninsured injury expenses.

    Perhaps you would allow one of those 5-day Dentistry course graduates to have a practice on yourself?
     
  8. JobAndKnock

    JobAndKnock

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    Interesting........

    For the benefit of the OP, I do mainly site work (admittedly as a joiner) and I'm expected in addition to a CSCS trade (competence) card, to hold appropriate Public Liability Insurance, have undertaken asbestos awarness training (because some older soffits and fascias can contain asbestos), a PASMA scaffolding tower card (assembly and usage training) as well as having a Working at Height certificate (in order to use a harness like the guy above safely). All the decos I've worked with in recent years have this sort of stuff and often additionally hold training cards for IPAF (e.g. scissor lifts, cherry pickers, etc). Insurers are becoming wary of covering you if you haven't had the appropriate safety training on this sort of thing as untrained users of access equipment can get into all sorts of bother. Because the range of equipment is now so great it may be better, as others have said, to hire in equipment as required. Most hire companies will advise on an appropriate set-up and many can carry out certificated training. As an independent you don't necessarily need all this, but I'd say that some form of ladder training, PASMA scaffold tower training and the asbestos awareness would be the minimum required. Remember that ladders are a contributing factor in a very high percentage of accidents at work and that's why professional outfits often opt for a scaffolding tower or even a MEWP (mobile elevating work platform, e.g. cherry picker, etc) as a safer method of access especially when working above ground floor level

    BTW, that photo may look OK, but if you ever do use a harness you absolutely must work with a second man who is briefed in how to get you down and out of the harness before you injure yourself - 20 minutes hanging around in a harness can cause a build up of toxins in the legs and you can die of toxemia when they do get you down after such a long period.
     
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  9. WabbitPoo

    WabbitPoo

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    I don't understand these "what to charge" posts......its up to you to decide what you need for a day's pay, anything over and above that is up to you to chance your arm. If you mean, what does everyone else charge?, then try getting a quote or two of your own.
     
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  11. DMA

    DMA

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    I did training for about 6 months, level 2 painting and decorating and every customer I have had so far has been happy and recommended me. The customer who wants me to do the windows shown above was a referral from another customer. He wants me to come back in September when he is getting scaffolding put up. But I would still like to know more about access equipment and if the access equipment I linked to above is safe. I did exams about health and safety but my training did not ever include information about those specific pieces of equipment. I'll also add that when I was doing my training I was doing better at things like stenciling than another guy who had loads of P&D work experience (he was only on the training course to get the qualification) I do a good job despite my lack of experience. I am a bit of a natural, I pick things up quickly after watching a few vids and I have good eye for detail, a bit of a perfectionist. In fact one customer wanted to help me out and basiclly told me that its his house so obviously he wants a nice looking house, but I am doing things to good, its bad for my business, just slap the paint on and do it quickly and dont worry about it being perfect lol...

    The things I am struggling with is the things you learn from experience, why I though to ask thous who know more than me. One of my other problems I have been finding is that customers want you to work for less than what works out to be minimum wage, not the £100-120 per day that I want to be getting, any tips on this? (my tutor who has around 40 years experience said I should be charging £100-120 a day)

    I think maybe the reason they dont want to pay high prices are 1.There are people doing P&D for £30-60 a day which kills the market 2.The customers underestimate how much time it takes to do what they want doing 3.They feel that painting and decorating is something anyone can do, so why pay decent money for a "simple job" to be done that they dont view as really being a "trade" in the first place.


    -I have recently started and for the technical things like wallpapering I am getting others who have years of experience to do it so that I can still offer a professional quality service to customers.
     
    Last edited: 7 Jul 2016
  12. CheshireDecorators

    CheshireDecorators

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    Notsure why you or anybody would set up a business and charge 100/120 per day? It's not worth it! You can go and work for somebody for 14ph+ and not have the hastle of running a business !

    15years ago £120 was OK but still nothing special
     
  13. DMA

    DMA

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    How much would you charge per day?
     
  14. CheshireDecorators

    CheshireDecorators

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    Well wouldnt put that on a public forum- alot more than 100/120per day
     
  15. CheshireDecorators

    CheshireDecorators

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    I reakon if you are charging 100/120 per day, by time you have had 3/4 weeks of per year and deducted expenses you will be lucky to get 20k per year....
     
  16. DMA

    DMA

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    I gave a quote to an elderly person a while ago, I did really cheep like £40 to freshen up the magnolia paint on her stairs and landing with 5lt of magnolia.

    She then asked me how much it would be if she brought her own paint from her friends shop lol, the paint I was going to get for her only costed £10, so was offering to do the who thing for £40 including the cost of the paint.

    She didnt get back to me still...

    I might up my prices to £145 a day if you think people will pay more than £120, not sure how high to go though before I'd be being unfair?
    I had been using http://local.which.co.uk/advice/cost-price-information-painters-decorators as a price guide, their prices may average out at about £100-195 per day
     
  17. CheshireDecorators

    CheshireDecorators

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    The key to earning good money with domestic work is to get customes that want a professional job. Not weekend warriors that think because they can paint there living room any one can do it, and there calling you just because they ain't got time-AVOID

    As a minimum people should be going £20ph £160per day but you can get that as a subby and more on site work but that's the bare minimum imo
     
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