1. Visiting from the US? Why not try DIYnot.US instead? Click here to continue to DIYnot.US.
    Dismiss Notice

Permanent feed off 2. Way switch?

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by Cavester, 17 Jul 2010.

  1. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Hi,

    Hoping someone with more knowledge can point me in the right direction...

    I am busy fitting a bathroom in my house and currently installing a mirror with light. For this I need a standard positive, negative and earthed 3 core cable.

    The closest electrical point to this is a 2 way switch on the other side of a stud partition wall controlling the lights for the hallway landing, together with a switch downstairs which controls a single light.

    In the landing switch I have 2 cables, ignoring neutrals for now the first has a red (L1) and a black (L2) and the other cable has a red (L1), yellow (COM), Blue (L2).

    My question is, how can I get a permanent feed from these wires to my mirror without the switch interfering with it's operation. I have tried various combinations but each time the 2 way switch affects the power going to my mirror.

    Thanks.
     
  2. Sponsored Links
  3. nozspark

    nozspark

    Joined:
    24 Aug 2006
    Messages:
    1,062
    Thanks Received:
    34
    Location:
    Flintshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    I doubt that you actually have a neutral at the switch.. my guess would be that they are all either permanent or switched lives (possibly inc strappers)

    Your best place for a permanent live and neutral would be a light fitting
     
  4. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Thanks,

    I connected the black and red cable up and it actually worked but I couldn't get those cables back in the switch without the switch affecting the mirror. If I need to take the feed from elsewhere it's going to cause major problems for me :(.
     
  5. nozspark

    nozspark

    Joined:
    24 Aug 2006
    Messages:
    1,062
    Thanks Received:
    34
    Location:
    Flintshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yep...

    I probably would seem to work, but the red is the permanent live and the black is a switched live for the other room..

    was it "switch off" mirror and light both on but 1/2 brightness
    and
    "switch on" mirror off and other light on full brightness??
     
  6. Taylortwocities

    Taylortwocities

    Joined:
    28 Jul 2006
    Messages:
    20,382
    Thanks Received:
    2,106
    Location:
    Oxfordshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    You'll have to take this from a light fitting. There is no neutral at the light switch.

    There is also no
    This is an AC lighting circuit, not a torch battery and bulb.

    Two things for you to look at

    Wiring diagrams for lighting circuits
    http://www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting

    and

    Information about who and how electrical work can be done in a bathroom (yes, even your own bathroom).
    http://www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:part_p:diy_electrical_work_and_the_law
     
  7. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,783
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    But then you only have yourself to blame, because you decided that it would be alright to do this:
    Without first taking the trouble to learn how to do it.

    You now have two, and only two options:

    1) Take the feed from elsewhere no matter how major the problems are.

    2) Don't have the light on the mirror working.


    I'm not indulging in schadenfreude here - I'm just hoping that people in the future will encounter this topic when searching and ask themselves why they think it's a good idea to try and do electrics if they don't have a clue how it works.
     
  8. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Your a happy chap mind. That's why I am here!! For your information the light mirror was an afterthought after realising the light in that area is not good given both the main room light and window are behind you when at the sink causing shadow. The idea of the mirror was to remedy this and have it installed as easily as possible. This means feeding from the closest source of power, hence coming here and asking the nice people of this forms advice on what I had found.

    Thanks to the kind help from Taylortocities and others I know know what I am doing because they pointed me to some easy to understand diagrams and provided constructive information.

    Thanks to you for making yourself look like an inconsiderate idiot.

    Regards.
     
  9. sparkwright

    sparkwright

    Joined:
    20 Aug 2009
    Messages:
    8,550
    Thanks Received:
    1,077
    Location:
    Dorset
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    So how are you going to do this now?

    Is running a new cable from the mirror light to the loft space (if there is one) an option?

    Failing that, you may be able to replace the red and black cable at the landing switch for a 3 core and earth cable. Assuming it's in a wall void or a conduit. This would give you an extra wire, which would provide you with a neutral, which you would obtain from the landing light or a junction box that serves the landing light.

    Maybe you have a socket nearby, that you can run a unswitched 3 amp fused spur from which can feed the new light.

    More information required. Photos all the more helpful.
     
  10. Sponsored Links
  11. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,783
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yup - AFTER you had tried blindly connecting various wires to various terminals without the first idea of what you were doing.


    An inconsiderate idiot.

    As opposed to the sort of person who thinks it's perfectly OK to fiddle with electrical installation work when he must realise that he knows absolutely nothing about it, and must realise that unless he plans to take his house with him when he goes he'll be leaving a legacy of electrical work done by someone without a clue for the next occupant?

    If you say so.


    I know virtually nothing about handling a sailing boat, and navigation etc, and have zero practical experience of those things. That does not make me an idiot.

    But deciding that despite my complete lack of competence it would be perfectly OK to jump into one and head out to sea would.
     
  12. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Thanks buddy. Yes took a line from a socket in the adjacent bedroom up the cavity so I now have a positive and negative permanent live.

    I will connect this to a 3amp fuse spur before connecting to the mirror, this sound ok? Can the fuse be on the internal side of the bathroom wall behind the mirror or with it being a bathroom will it need to be outside of the bathroom?

    Thanks for the help.

    Cheers.

    P.S. ban-all -sheds its obvious by your name you are one of these disgrutled types so I am not going to even bother fueling your flames mate, jog on.
     
  13. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,783
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
     
  14. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Shedhead, your lass probably calls yours a weena but you think its a dong, there the same thing at the end of the day to each of you.

    For others information, thanks for the help I have now got it sorted. wired from existing socket on bedroom side to 3 amp fuse spur placed next to the socket, then from that to the mirror in the bathroom. Main fusebox is RCD so all should be safe with that.

    On the positive side from shedman I now know where to come to seek help before sticking wires in places I dont understand :).

    Thanks again for the kind help.
     
  15. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,783
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Well next time try to remember that you know ⅔ of SFA, and that only an inconsiderate idiot would decide that lack of knowledge should not be a bar to working on circuits carrying lethal voltages.
     
  16. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Sound advice from shedhead there folks. Can't argue with that. Although by design the house is RCD protected so the worst that would happen would be a blown fuse. I'm not stupid enough to go mashing my cables into the live sockets with a metal screwdriver here, oh no, I used a plastic one...
     
  17. Cavester

    Cavester

    Joined:
    17 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tyne and Wear
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    ... and wearing rubber shoes, so nah!
     
Loading...

Share This Page