Plumber has been, few questions - Help needed please

[Tom1981]

I highly recommend the Spirotech MB3 http://www.spirotrapmb3.co.uk/

The magnaclean is good at picking up the rubbish, but 70% will leak, even if they have the new seals and valves fitted, I've also found the magnets are starting to split now in the older models meaning they need replacing.

The Spirotech is just a jet out via the drain point.

 

[hazetimesfive]

shame it doesn't have isolation valves.

 

[Dan Robinson]

but 70% will leak, even if they have the new seals and valves fitted, I've also found the magnets are starting to split now in the older models meaning they need replacing

70%?

Utter crap.

Magnets have a lifetime guarantee. Have had a couple of those g, and Adey have replaced them without question. Even paying for a replacement rug when one shot off its base when I was demonstrating to a customer.

 

[Agile]

Your pump valves will enable the pump to be easily changed if that was ever needed.

Its so simple that its an easy DIY job.

I do have to say I dont see why this pumber is trying to big up the job. If he needs to earn more thats better by just charging a bit more for the job which is required to solve the problem.

As far as I can guess ALL that is needed is a new motor valve HEAD. That does not need any draining.

Cleaning the system will do no harm but when thats done I dont see any serious need to fit a magnetic filter.

Tony

 

[neiltheplumber]

Are you sure he said fit a TF1 between the 3 port valve and pump? Better fitted on return before goes back into boiler! I prefer TF1 filters to Magnacleans but spirostrap MB3's are better.

 

[DP]

pop 80, the motorised valve needs to do nothing for HW. The system runs under control of HW thermostat during HW mode. If no HW when timer is fired up, then changing the three port valve will make no difference.


Regards pump- the one he is suggesting will be underpowered. He is wrong wrong wrong and wrong. Afraid our Tony is also slipping up when he says pump is recent.

The filter is fitted on the pipe that takes water back to the boiler. If you have an old boiler as is suggestive looking at the pump, fitting the filter will be helpful but not necessary as waterways will be hugh compared to those in moder boilers. Also, plumbing looks good, so suspect was installed by a real plumber.

4) would take that with a pinch of salt.

5) Again bring out the salt.

 

[Tom1981]

shame it doesn't have isolation valves.

Does it need any? You don't need to remove it to clean.

70%?

Utter crap.

Magnets have a lifetime guarantee. Have had a couple of those g, and Adey have replaced them without question. Even paying for a replacement rug when one shot off its base when I was demonstrating to a customer.

Yep I'd say about 70%. I see quite a few as BG did have a big drive to fit them. The old red handle isolation valves have a habit of leaking. These can be replaced of course but that has its own problems. Undoing or tightening up can chew the plastic thread on the magnet body, the fitting can unscrew from the isolation valve, and even with 2 o-rings they can still leak.

Then there was the main O-Rings, the red dye ones leaked then heating up and cooling down, even now there's quiet a few of the originals kicking about.

And then yes the magnet, I'm getting sick of scrapping the sludge off the magnet to refit it, or having to rebook a visit to replace it.

The Magnaclean wasn't as good as it was made out to be, I know the newer ones have also ironed out the issues and had a slight redesign.

MB3, a bucket and hose and a good blast from the drain point and jobs done.

It's all down to choice.

 

[pop80_uk]

pop 80, the motorised valve needs to do nothing for HW. The system runs under control of HW thermostat during HW mode. If no HW when timer is fired up, then changing the three port valve will make no difference.


Regards pump- the one he is suggesting will be underpowered. He is wrong wrong wrong and wrong. Afraid our Tony is also slipping up when he says pump is recent.

The filter is fitted on the pipe that takes water back to the boiler. If you have an old boiler as is suggestive looking at the pump, fitting the filter will be helpful but not necessary as waterways will be hugh compared to those in moder boilers. Also, plumbing looks good, so suspect was installed by a real plumber.

4) would take that with a pinch of salt.

5) Again bring out the salt.

Thank you to every, please keep the advice coming

HW works fine on the timer and will work alone, its the CH which only works when the HW is on. The CH will not work on its own it needs the HW to be on. But it should not be like this (and it costs us a fortune!)

How long should these pumps last for?

I have a Baxi boiler, it looks its from around 1985, its not new but seems to work fine, will this negate the need for one of these fancy filters ?

 

[Dan Robinson]

I have some on our books that must be 30 years.

Sure other pro's here have older ones in their care.

If the rads are evenly hot, with no cold spots, and the water wasn't like oil coming out of the system, then you might as well save you pennies.

 

[pop80_uk]

I have some on our books that must be 30 years.

Sure other pro's here have older ones in their care.

If the rads are evenly hot, with no cold spots, and the water wasn't like oil coming out of the system, then you might as well save you pennies.

Thank you,

I think I will tell him to leave the pump and filter,

There have been a couple of people who mentioned the three way may not fix my problems, what do people think?

 

[D_Hailsham]

This is our problem:
Basically the Hot water needs to be on for the central heating to work, we have a very modern control panel which allows both to operate independently how ever when you select just the CH then nothing happens.

There are three possible reasons for this:

1. The programmer is set to Gravity instead of Pumped;
2. The valve has not been wired correctly;
3. The valve is sticking.

Here's how to check:

Programmer
Turn off mains
Loosen two screws holding programmer to wall plate
Swivel upwards to remove.
On the back there is a row of small switches near the bottom.
Switch 5 is the one you are interested in.
If it's UP, that's OK; just replace the programmer and move on to checking valve wiring.

If switch 5 is DOWN, move it to UP. Replace programmer and check if that's solved the problem.

If it hasn't, move on to checking valve wiring.

Valve wiring
Turn power off and remove cover from junction box on the wall.
The black cable from the valve has 5 wires: blue, green/yellow, grey, orange and white. It's the grey one we are interested in.

The grey wire should go to a terminal which has two other wires connected. One will come from the cylinder thermostat; the other from the programmer. If either of these wires are missing, there's a wiring fault.

Another slight possibility is that the orange wire is not connected properly.

If valve is wired correctly, check valve is not sticking.

Sticking valve
You can only do this if your valve have a small bump on the top near the screw.
Turn power off
Remove the cover (screw at one end)
Remove the actuator (mechanism) - two screws diagonally opposite.
This exposes the valve spindle.
The spindle should turn easily by hand (less than a quarter circle.)
If the spindle is stiff (needs pliers to turn); lubricate it with a little silicon lubricant (Not WD40 which rots the seals).
Reassemble and check system operation.

If the problem still exists the valve actuator is faulty and will need replacing.

As for the plumber's other suggestions, as Tony (Agile) says, they seem to be just a money-making ploy and not related to your problem.

 

[pop80_uk]

This is our problem:
Basically the Hot water needs to be on for the central heating to work, we have a very modern control panel which allows both to operate independently how ever when you select just the CH then nothing happens.

There are three possible reasons for this:

1. The programmer is set to Gravity instead of Pumped;
2. The valve has not been wired correctly;
3. The valve is sticking.

Here's how to check:

Programmer
Turn off mains
Loosen two screws holding programmer to wall plate
Swivel upwards to remove.
On the back there is a row of small switches near the bottom.
Switch 5 is the one you are interested in.
If it's UP, that's OK; just replace the programmer and move on to checking valve wiring.

If switch 5 is DOWN, move it to UP. Replace programmer and check if that's solved the problem.

If it hasn't, move on to checking valve wiring.

Valve wiring
Turn power off and remove cover from junction box on the wall.
The black cable from the valve has 5 wires: blue, green/yellow, grey, orange and white. It's the grey one we are interested in.

The grey wire should go to a terminal which has two other wires connected. One will come from the cylinder thermostat; the other from the programmer. If either of these wires are missing, there's a wiring fault.

Another slight possibility is that the orange wire is not connected properly.

If valve is wired correctly, check valve is not sticking.

Sticking valve
You can only do this if your valve have a small bump on the top near the screw.
Turn power off
Remove the cover (screw at one end)
Remove the actuator (mechanism) - two screws diagonally opposite.
This exposes the valve spindle.
The spindle should turn easily by hand (less than a quarter circle.)
If the spindle is stiff (needs pliers to turn); lubricate it with a little silicon lubricant (Not WD40 which rots the seals).
Reassemble and check system operation.

If the problem still exists the valve actuator is faulty and will need replacing.

As for the plumber's other suggestions, as Tony (Agile) says, they seem to be just a money-making ploy and not related to your problem.

Thank you!
I will follow this advice to the letter and report back

 

[pop80_uk]

Just one update,
The plumber phoned up earlier today to ask what I wanted him to order, I asked him to hold off for few days, but that I would not need the pump as I could replace it myself if needed (following advice from here)

He then told me over the phone it was impossible, as I have a drain plug which can only be un tightened with a special key and process, is this correct? (ive posted a picture below), it does not look like other drains ive seen

 

[Dan Robinson]

As I was suspecting... he is a prannet...


The pump has isolation valves either side.

Turn them off, Bob's a close relative.

There will be a bit of water in the pump body but you wouldn't worry over it.

Tell the bloke to jog on.

As mentioned before - you need to correctly diagnose the problem with the mid position valve and connected controls. The pump is the least of your worries.

 

[hazetimesfive]

shame it doesn't have isolation valves.

Does it need any? You don't need to remove it to clean.

couple of times i've had to take them off to really get the ****e out the mesh.