Skirting techniques.

[joe-90]

But what is the benefit? A perfect joint is a perfect joint.
Why waste time and effort to get the same result?
I don't hold out much hope for your business if you simply waste time for the heck of it.
Why don't you fasten them with a plugging chisel like the Victorians did? You are a traditionalist after all. Bet you use electric power tools too? Shame on you.



joe

 

[splinter]

We have establised you are not a carpenter ,obviously the people that you get to do you're carpentry are not either and I doubt if the work carried out in you're properties are of a very high spec.
Like I said if you or argueing over this most basic part of carpentry and do not understand the fundimentals of it I would not have faith in any of the carpentry work carried out in you're properties

 

[joe-90]

We have establised you are not a carpenter ,obviously the people that you get to do you're carpentry are not either and I doubt if the work carried out in you're properties are of a very high spec.
Like I said if you or argueing over this most basic part of carpentry and do not understand the fundimentals of it I would not have faith in any of the carpentry work carried out in you're properties

In other words you are a pompous oaf that is trying to bluff it.

I ask you again. What is the benefit?

Why are you not a traditionalist in all things?

Why only this one?

You have no idea what I build or how well so you can stop that silly line.




joe

 

[splinter]

LEts get this right,I don't need to bluff my way as I know my trade.

The benifit ,you can read this any basic carpentry book

Iam a traditionlist in most aspects of carpentryby the fact that very little has changed in the carpentry trade over the last 50yrs don't forget we are talking about wood here not rocket science.
Iwill continue with that silly one ,because ,if you or you're carpenters do not understand the basics of carpentry What hope have you got with the rest

 

[mr_mike]

The problem is Joe 90, that your "perfect joints" are only perfect cosmetically for a shorter time than scribed internal joints. That won't matter to you because you're "a property renovator" (n.b. not a property restorer).

Your internal "perfect joints" will open up as a result of shrinkage over time a lot more, and form a much larger gap eventually than scribes.

There is a reason why they are done like that, but that ain't gonna matter to you because you're in it for a quick buck and couldn't give a rat's arse whether your cosmetically perfect joints open up in x amount of years time.

The general consensus seems to be everyone do it just how they like and what works for you works for you. Count me in as one of the "pompous oafs " that takes pride in their work and does it properly.

 

[big-all]

ok time to put this one to bed before it becomes counter productive

scribes only open up half as much because the wood shrinks accross the grain
so in a scribe the scribed part moves along and parralel to the front edge of the other part which will move toward the wall

where as in mitres both surfaces are pulling back towards the wall so it opens twice as much as they are moving at right angles against each other

 

[joe-90]

I've used both methods over the years and in my opinion there is little if any difference in how they last. Secondly, who in hell ever looks at internal mitred joints? If mitres are good enough for external joints they are good enough for internal joints.
Traditional means no power tools, no plastic, no profit.
I don't think any of you are traditionalists.
I build bespoke wood and glass conservatories using traditional joints and methods but I'm also a realist. If you build well (which I do) then shrinkage and the likes isn't a problem.
The problem here is that one member of this particular part of the forum has set himself up as an authority and is being totally pompous that someone else should suggest a different method of doing something. There are more ways than one to do any job, and the method I use for skirting is the quickest and easiest and gives exactly the same results.

You do it your way and I'll do it mine. It's called choice.




joe

 

[mr_mike]

Apologys Big-all.....and I hope my comments aren't counter productive....but there is a certain arrogance here that just doesn't sit well with me.

If you stopped for a second Joe-90, read the thread and thought about it, it's just been explained to you technically why mitres are fine for externals but not as good for internals. You do them your way, that's fine by me, only isn't it good to understand (and essential if you're a tradesman) to understand why wood does what it does ? (in terms of shrinkage and jointing).

Shrinkage will become a problem, but probably not within a timescale that's gonna affect you personally.

Who said anything about not using power tools ? Of course the bleedin' Victorians would have used power tools if they'd had them, no one's disputing that. And modern 'traditional' chippys will use compund mitre saws, routers and modern jointing methods like biscuit jointing and the like, but there are also some methods that have remained the same for the last 150 years because they are still the best way of doing them.

Unfortunately, because profit is all these days (and I'm 36 and one of Thatcher's children by default), we are surrounded by sh*te badly built modern propertys, and Ikea style badly jointed flimsy furniture that just doesn't stand the test of time. But hey, who's gonna bother looking at how they're cheapy sh*tey furniture's jointed.....

I'm tellin' ya...."one day a rain's gonna come and wash all this......" (Travis Bickle - Taxi Driver)

I would go for a lie down in a dark room now.....but I've got work to do.....and a pile of bleedin' power tool boxes to load and unload.....

 

[big-all]

ok just to clarify external mitres CLOSE up with shrinkage as the wood shrinks towards the wall thus pulling the mitre tighter

 

[joe-90]

If you were any good at what you did you would leave the timber to aclimatise to the room conditions before you even touched it. Then it won't shrink.

Secondly timber shrinks down the whole of it's length which is why doors won't shut when they get wet.

Thirdly, no-one bar no-one ever looks at the internal mitres of skirting board.

I refuse to touch plastic windows and doors on account that I believe they are destroying the charm of our heritage - but I bet that you fit them no problems. They should be banned in my opinion.

The work I do is fine. Never had a complaint in my working life.

You do what you want to do - and I'll do what I want to do.

joe

 

[big-all]

shrinkage or expansion in wood is virtualy nill along the grain
shrinkage accross the grain would far exceed any movement along the grain

indeed if it did shrink along the grain to any extent it would be pointless trying to do any joint as it would open up regardless of how good a fit
and imagine if it was a 4.2m run !!!!! you could store your pencils in the gap

 

[joe-90]

shrinkage or expansion in wood is virtualy nill along the grain
shrinkage accross the grain would far exceed any movement along the grain

indeed if it did shrink along the grain to any extent it would be pointless trying to do any joint as it would open up regardless of how good a fit
and imagine if it was a 4.2m run !!!!! you could store your pencils in the gap

What does shrinkage across the grain have to do with skirting? You do let your timber aclimatise don't you? It only shrinks when it loses water and only expands when it absorbs water. In a stable environment it goes nowhere. Have you done *any* woodwork?


joe

 

[splinter]

JOE 90 aka Rigsby of rising damp fame.just's posts for the arguement

 

[joe-90]

JOE 90 aka Rigsby of rising damp fame.just's posts for the arguement

I note that you have no answer.


joe

 

[mr_mike]

I dunno why I'm bothering, but.....in response to Joe

Firstly, even room acclimatised wood will shrink after years and years of battering by modern central heating. The shrinkage will occur in years to come, like I said well after you've 'renovated' your property and parted with the cash.

Secondly doors get stuck when they're wet because they draw in moisture and e x p a n d !!!!!! NOT SHRINK.

Thirdly, no one looks at internal mitres until the barsteward things open up in 10, 15, 20 years time when incorrectly jointed !!!

Go ahead and do what you want to do, and stop picking fights. If your were that confident about your work, you wouldn't feel the need to defend it so vehemently (good word, eh ? hope I spelt it right....)