The Jew hating thread

[fillyboy]

Artillery...

View attachment 394059

Artillery.

MSN

 

[Knave of Hearts]

Has any state got the right to exist.
States come and go.
Whatever happened to the likes of Yugoslavia or Czechoslovakia.

Examples of which could be, 'collateral damage' = 50 innocents killed in order to eliminate one guilty person.
'Relocation to a safe area'= ethnic cleansing.ect.

The United Nations right to self-determination, first established in the UN Charter (Article 1(2)), is the principle that all peoples have the right to freely determine their political status and pursue their economic, social, and cultural development. While it was initially crucial for decolonization, the right is now a fundamental human right, though its application is complex. It is further elaborated in the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples, which emphasizes the need for steps to enable the peoples of non-self-governing territories to exercise their right to complete independence.

Self-determination is a cardinal principle in modern international law, binding, as such, on the United Nations as an authoritative interpretation of the Charter's norms.[4][5] The principle does not state how the decision is to be made, nor what the outcome should be (whether independence, federation, protection, some form of autonomy or full assimilation),[6] and the right of self-determination does not necessarily include a right to an independent state for every ethnic group within a former colonial territory.

Self-determination - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Thus the creation of a new Israel, within the original Palestine, by the UN, violated the basic tenet of UN norms and International Law.

But there's no way back from here. Just find a way forward.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

As far as I know , other Arab countries invaded Palestine to prevent the Israelis from ethnically cleansing Palestinians.

The civil war(s) before 1947 was Palestinians V Britain due to Britain allowing Jews to buy land and to migrate into Palestine, and Palestinians V Jews, and Jews V Britain when Britain tried to limit the number of migrating Jews.

The Arabs declared war on Jews in 1948 following the illegal declaration of the state of Israel*, and the ensuing ethnic cleansing of Palestinians by Jews.

* Illegal due to violating the basic tenet of the UN and International Law of the right to self-determination, and over and beyond the UN resolution.

 

[fillyboy]

The civil war(s) before 1947 was Palestinians V Britain due to Britain allowing Jews to buy land and to migrate into Palestine, and Palestinians V Jews, and Jews V Britain when Britain tried to limit the number of migrating Jews.

Jews started buying land from the Turks in the 1880's

The Arabs declared war on Jews in 1948 following the illegal declaration of the state of Israel*, and the ensuing ethnic cleansing of Palestinians by Jews.

* Illegal due to violating the basic tenet of the UN and International Law of the right to self-determination, and over and beyond the UN resolution.

Nothing illegal about Israeli statehood under Resolution 181, just because you try to re-define the law doesn't make it so.

The Palestinians could have chosen to do the same, many Palestinians regret not doing so.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

Or it could be that they support a fight against terror

Colonialism is frequently expressed as a fight against terror. The excuse used is to bring civilisation to the masses. In reality, it usually uses terror in order to achieve its aims.
We've already established that the designation of terrorists is a purely subjective label depending on the political ideology of those labelling others as terrorists.

Sinn Fein and IRA were designated as terrorists by UK.
Sinn Fein were the political arm, and IRA the military arm of the party.

The ludicrous situation was that Sinn Fein were a legal and acceptable political party in Ireland, and even had NI MP's elected to UK Parliament,despite being designated as terrorists by UK.

So "terrorists" are merely labels put on freedom fighters, as a propaganda tool, unless and until a group intentionally target civilians as a means to create terror.
In that case Britain, in its colonial past, has invariably been terrorists in more or less all of its conflicts and colonial governments.
And by the same token Israel is currently spreading fear and terror among Palestinians.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

The Al-Qassam Brigades?, still fighting, still holding hostages.

Israel still holding 10,000 Palestinian hostages, abusing and killing them.
Israel starving 2,000,000 Palestinians and causing disease, destroying and denying medical provision.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

Jews started buying land from the Turks in the 1880's

Fillystine forgot to mention the difference in scale.

Turkey sold a negligible amount of land to Jewish buyers compared to the amount acquired by Jewish purchasers in British-administered Palestine, which was roughly 6.6% of the total area by 1947.

• No Significant Land Sales:
  There is no historical record or substantial claim of Turkey selling large quantities of land to Jewish buyers.

Nothing illegal about Israeli statehood under Resolution 181, just because you try to re-define the law doesn't make it so.

The Resolution itself violated a basic tenet of UN norms.
Th Arab nations opposing the Resolution warned of consequences if it was approved.

The Palestinians could have chosen to do the same, many Palestinians regret not doing so.

How many have you asked?

 

[fillyboy]

How many have you asked?

So, you're saying no Palestinians want they're own state, OK.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

So, you're saying no Palestinians want they're own state, OK.

Read and understand your own post.

The Palestinians could have chosen to do the same, many Palestinians regret not doing so.

You claim that many Palestinians regret something. How many have you asked?

 

[fillyboy]

You claim that many Palestinians regret something. How many have you asked?

None, so I'll accept your assertion that no Palestinians want their own state.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

None, so I'll accept your assertion that no Palestinians want their own state.

You're reinforcing your reputation for being a Fillystine., by being unaware of the use of tenses in English written and spoken use.
'Regret' refers to historical actions or inactions.
'Want' is the present tense form of "to want".

You used 'regret' to suggest the attitude of Palestinians now, in relation to their past actions or inactions.

You openly admit that you have consulted no Palestinians as to whether they regret anything.
Yet you posit your opinion of what they think.


You really ought to start on that book I recommended.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/English-Grammar-Dummies-Lesley-Ward/dp/0470057521

 

[Vinty]

So "terrorists" are merely labels put on freedom fighters, as a propaganda tool, unless and until a group intentionally target civilians as a means to create terror

The IRA cannot be considered 'Freedom fighters' as they had no mandate from the Nationalist/Catholic community to engage in campaign of terrorism on their behalf.

 

[fillyboy]

You openly admit that you have consulted no Palestinians as to whether they regret anything.
Yet you posit your opinion of what they think.

It's not 'my' opinion, it's based on opinions of Palestinians I've read, that they regret not going for UN 181 as a means to having their own state, it was a mistake on their part. You refute this so you are basically saying Palestinians don't want their own state.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

The IRA cannot be considered 'Freedom fighters' as they had no mandate from the Nationalist/Catholic community to engage in campaign of terrorism on their behalf.

Terrorism is the intentional targeting of civilians to spread fear and terror. It has little to do with their political ambitions or ideology.
As such, I agree that the IRA did frequently engage in terrorist activities. But not so Sinn Fein. yet Sinn Fein were labelled as terrorists, when they were a genuine political party with a mandate, not only in Ireland, but also in NI.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

It's not 'my' opinion, it's based on opinions of Palestinians I've read, that they regret not going for UN 181 as a means to having their own state, it was a mistake on their part.

Got a link to what you've read?

You refute this so you are basically saying Palestinians don't want their own state.

You're still confused and trying to conflate your opinion of what you think Palestinians want now, and any possible feelings they have about their previous actions or inactions.

Read the book I recommended and try to understand the difference between present tense and past tense.