trying to install ceiling lights

[Speediii]

Hi all,

I have successfully installed to ceiling lights and have come to a problem with 2 other ceiling lights. The first has x3 earth, live and neutral wires, I have installed the ceiling light using one of each and have used black tape to secure the others but I have no light. This hasn't seemed to have worked, what have I done wrong?

The 2nd ceiling in the hallway doesn't seem to have an exposed earth cable. I can connect the live and neutral able but what do I do about the earth cable?

For some reason I believe because of these issues our kitchen, bathroom and back bedroom lights do not turn on

Please see the pictures attached.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Regards
Speediii

 

[EFLImpudence]

https://www.diynot.com/wiki/Electrics:Lighting-Rose

 

[beege]

Speedii, you say there is 3 live, 3 neutral and 3 earth wires which sounds right... were all 3 of these connected to the old light fitting?

 

[Speediii]

beege, yes they were all connect to the old light fitting. They're very difficult to attach all 3 to the new lighting.

 

[Speediii]

EFLImpudence, I have removed all the old fitting and shownh in the 1st picture. Is it possible to connect the live and neutral but no earth wire?

 

[flameport]

what have I done wrong?

You have taken a wiring system that was connected in a certain way, then removed wires and reconnected some of the wires in a different way.
Now it doesn't work - this is because it can only work as intended when all of the wires are connected correctly.

Tape is not an acceptable method of connecting wires.
If there is no earth, lights requiring an earth cannot be used.

There are now only two choices:
If you took proper notes of how the wiring was connected previously, put it all back exactly how it was before
If not, then pay an electrician to do it for you.

 

[EFLImpudence]

NO. You must do this as in the last picture (Don't bother with the red tape)

If your light does not have an earth, you must still connect the other three together.

 

[beege]

All 3 sets of cables need to be connected for the lights to work as they will probably be part of a circuit, starting from the consumer unit and going to each light in turn. The link above is very useful, as are other lighting diagrams near the top of the electrical forum.

Normally one of the lives would be from the previous light or consumer unit, one would go to the next light in the circuit and the 3rd one would go to the switch on the wall.

One neutral is from the previous light or consumer unit, one goes to the next light in the circuit.
The 3rd neutral is not actually a neutral, it is known as a switched live. When the switch is on, the switched live completes the circuit back to the light to allow current to flow. This is normally identified with brown/red sleeving to indicate it can be live and therefore carries 230V.

The earths (or CPCs) would normally be all connected together.

As mentioned before please have a look at the diagrams as they are very informative.

**Please note I am not an electrician, this is just my basic knowledge of DIY electrical. Unless you are 100% sure of what connections to make, I would recommend you call an electrician**

Hope this helps
Beege

 

[beege]

 

[Speediii]

Beege, I have connected all the cables to a ceiling light and the light now seems to work... however it seems as if there is some sort of direct connect as the light switch isn't doing anything anymore.

The light constantly stays on.

EFLimpudence, flameport, think I might have a sparky look at the other light as I naively took it all apart and have no idea how to put it back together.

 

[beege]

Have you identified the which one is the switched live?

Just looked at the pictures again and it’s
not the clearest but it looks like you have 4 red wires, one of which has yellow tape on? If this is the case then it is likely (but not certain) that this is the switched live. It’s not as common but it is possible to but twin & earth with two red wires for the switch drop.

It’s not the easiest trying to explain this over a forum without seeing it in real life, I’m happy to try and explain to you my understanding of how it works but my advice would be to get an electrician in if you are not 100% sure of what should be connected to where.

 

[beege]

Any sparks on here that wouldn’t mind reading my posts and confirming what I have explained is correct?

I’m confident that I understand it and would have no issue doing this in my own home, I just wanted to double check that I’m not mis-informing the OP by giving inaccurate information

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, I think you are all correct - especially now with the twin red cable.

All that needed to be done was connect the two black wires to the light neutral and the red to the light live, plus earth, of course, if required.

Things are exactly the same as in the links and pictures shown - and with the twin red switch wires, all but impossible to get wrong.

 

[beege]

Yes, I think you are all correct - especially now with the twin red cable.

All that needed to be done was connect the two black wires to the light neutral and the red to the light live, plus earth, of course, if required.

Things are exactly the same as in the links and pictures shown - and with the twin red switch wires, all but impossible to get wrong.

View attachment 167624

Thanks EFL, I should have looked at picture properly in the first place.

 

[beege]

Speediii, hope my explanation wasn’t too confusing.

Basically you should have the following:

All earths connected together

Neutral from previous light and neutral to next light both connected to neutral on light fitting

Live from previous light and live to next light connected to switch drop

Switched live connected to live on light fitting.

Hope this helps