Neither would having them all brown.
They only have to be, by regulation, identified as Line etc.; not which of several Lines.
You can do that with a pen.
I am only thinking of domestic; not complex boards.
Twin brown brown and earth
- Thread starter AndyPRK
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They only have to be, by regulation, identified as Line etc.; not which of several Lines.
You can do that with a pen.
I am only thinking of domestic; not complex boards.
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I think you are probably letting your argument carry you away a bit.
You surely would not regard using a (otherwise unidentified on the cable/conductor) blue conductor for line as being 'compliant' because it was connected to a terminal with an 'L' written next to it (on the basis of your suggestion that that constituted 'alphanumeric identification' of the conductor), would you?
Try to keep safe.
Kind Regards, John
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Surely it would uniquely identify each conductor?
Yeah it would work when installing from scratch.
Not good when fault finding where many brown wires and cables stuffed into a back box.
Not good when fault finding where many brown wires and cables stuffed into a back box.
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OOO now let me see...
In my kitchen I have 3 doors:
By hall 3x 2way. = 3x 3C&E = 9 wires
Patio door 3x 2way. =3x 3C&E = 9 wires
Both of these would be far from ideal without some sort of markings
BUT the thought of:
Garden door 3x intermediate 1x 2way. = 7x 3C&E + 4xT&E = 29 wires
Just imagine trying to fault find on 29 brown wires with no identifting features...
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I don't understand.You surely would not regard using a (otherwise unidentified on the cable/conductor) blue conductor for line as being 'compliant' because it was connected to a terminal with an 'L' written next to it (on the basis of your suggestion that that constituted 'alphanumeric identification' of the conductor), would you?
That is the position in most light switches throughout the country. Black or blue wire connected to L1.
Even that L1 is not necessary to identify the purpose of the conductor, although whether it is the PL or SL is not required to be identified.
Of course it would.
I can just imagine the start of the thread...
I've purchased a silver/gold/sky blue pink(or whatever the current fashion is) 4 gang switch and removed the old white one and now I don't know where all the wires go.
Then there will be the regular argy bargy with posts like these
If I'm honest I'd be nervous seeing so many unidentified wires in that situation
Yes, on reflection you are right - I spoke/wrote too hastily.
Kind Regards, John
In practical terms, you're obviously right - but we are talking about compliance with the regs (with which many of the cables to light switches throughout the country do not comply).
I don't think you really believe that connecting a black or blue conductor (not otherwise identified) to a switch terminal adequately 'identifies' the conductor as a line one, as required by regs, do you?
Kind Regards, John
As it happens I know I still have some 2w switches which only have one terminal marked and that is with 'C', the top and bottom terminals have no markngs.
How then could you possibly 'identify' the wires? Was it only the fact that they were, or were sleeved, Brown/Red
If they were not, did you think one of them might have been a Neutral?
Are you suggesting that the black/blue conductor would be adequately 'identified' (as being L or S/L, rather then N) by the fact that there was no bang when one operated the switch connected to it (and also to a red or brown)? If so, I'm not sure that would be within the spirit of BS7671's ideas about 'identification'
Kind Regards, John
Take this picture from a recent thread:
How did we know which wire was what when we can see no switch markings.
How did we distinguish between the Loop in/out and the switched Lines - which is not required to be distinguished?
Was it only because they were Brown or Blue that we knew what was going on?
Had all the wires been White, would it have made any difference?
Obviously the installer has to know which is Neutral, Loop and Switched Lives, but once installed, I am saying that the conductors are then 'identified'.
As I told the poster of that picture, mark the wires before disconnection but that was only to distinguish between the Lines which is not required nor necessary for compliance with the regulations.
How did we know which wire was what when we can see no switch markings.
How did we distinguish between the Loop in/out and the switched Lines - which is not required to be distinguished?
Was it only because they were Brown or Blue that we knew what was going on?
Had all the wires been White, would it have made any difference?
Obviously the installer has to know which is Neutral, Loop and Switched Lives, but once installed, I am saying that the conductors are then 'identified'.
As I told the poster of that picture, mark the wires before disconnection but that was only to distinguish between the Lines which is not required nor necessary for compliance with the regulations.
Obviously not, but that picture presumably depicts a regs-compliant situation.
I remind you that we are talking about the regs (which require only that 'identification' distinguishes L and N), not about identifying the function of each conductor. If some of those browns were blue (with no other identification), your argument would presumably be much the same, but then it would not be regs-compliant.
In terms of 'functional identification', no - but that would not be regs-complaint.
As I've said, if some of those browns were black and some were grey, then one would be ale to have some 'functional identification'.
Kind Regards, John
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