Wiring a PIR in bathroom help...

[damage]

Hi guys,
Im trying to wire up a PIR in my bathroom but dont seem to be having any success.

The wiring diagram that comes with thr PIR:

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/80538...Photocells/IQ-Ceiling-360-PIR-Movement-Sensor

Says that I should have L - N - E, the clolours I have are Black - Red - Yellow / green.

I have wired up the PIR so that the Black wires go into the Live Terminal , the Yellow/Geen go into the Earth Terminal and the Red wires goto the L2 connection. This is how they were wired up in the original bathroom celing pull cord.

However, by wiring the way I have the PIR won't work. Nothing has gone bang or smells of burning so I am thinking that either:

1) The PIR is knackered.

2) The Red wires should not be going to the L2 terminal?

The lights in the bathroom at two GU10 down lighters.

Can anyone help me?

 

[ColJack]

you need a neutral that isn't present at the light switch..

you have permanent live ( red ) switched live ( black - which should have red sleeving on it... ) and earth...

you need to replace the wire that comes from the light to the switch with a 3 core and earth wire..

 

[damage]

you need a neutral that isn't present at the light switch..

you have permanent live ( red ) switched live ( black - which should have red sleeving on it... ) and earth...

you need to replace the wire that comes from the light to the switch with a 3 core and earth wire..

Coming out of the celing I have two cores of three cables.

Both have G/Y - B - R and one of the Blacks does have a Red sleeving on it.

So, the three wires which include the Black WITHOUT the Red sleeve needs to be changed, is that correct?

 

[saxondale]

you need to hand the job over to a competant and cetified electrical contractor

 

[damage]

you need to hand the job over to a competant and cetified electrical contractor

I think you are right!!!

 

[saxondale]

good man - it isnt a saving if it kills somone

 

[ColJack]

where are these wires comming out from?

at the switch you should have only 1 cable with red and black ( with red sleeve) and a bare earth wire ( which should have yellow and green sleeving on it.. )

the cables you mention are at the light yes?

if so then the cable with the black with red sleeving that goes to the light switch needs to be changed...

you need to connect a 3 core and earth to the following at the light..

brown ( new ) to the red ( old )
grey ( sleeved brown( new )) to the light ( live )
black ( new and old ) to the light ( neutral )
earth ( sleeved green and yellow ( old and new )) to the light ( earth ) or a connector block if the light has no earth

you need to then connect the 3 core and earth to the following at the PIR switch...

brown to ( L )
grey ( sleeved brown ) to ( L1 switched load out )
black to ( N )
earth ( sleeved green and yellow ) to ( E )

 

[damage]

where are these wires comming out from?

at the switch you should have only 1 cable with red and black ( with red sleeve) and a bare earth wire ( which should have yellow and green sleeving on it.. )

the cables you mention are at the light yes?

Hi,
Thanks for getting back to me.

The cables I can see (6 in total, two pairs of each) are coming through the bathroom celing and into the pull cord light switch.

We have two downlighters in the bathroom celin, I looked in the loft and the two lights are connected together and and a cable from each light then goes to the pull cord switch.

I founnd this PIR on eBay, says it only needs two wires to operate:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Clipsal-Autom...215QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem[url]

Only problem is that it is designed for use in Australia![/url]

 

[saxondale]

Damage - where do you live?

 

[damage]

Damage - where do you live?

Not in Australia! The guy selling the OZ Pir says the voltages are all OK for UK but the unit has no BS marks!

 

[Spark123]

brown ( new ) to the red ( old )
grey ( sleeved brown( new )) to the light ( live )
black ( new and old ) to the light ( neutral )
earth ( sleeved green and yellow ( old and new )) to the light ( earth ) or a connector block if the light has no earth

you need to then connect the 3 core and earth to the following at the PIR switch...

brown to ( L )
grey ( sleeved brown ) to ( L1 switched load out )
black to ( N )
earth ( sleeved green and yellow ) to ( E )

Aren't neutrals meant to be sleeved blue? Personal preference is to use the grey core (sleeved blue) as a neutral and the black (sleeved brown) as phase. I have not seen anything cast in stone on this, they should however be correctly identified at both ends using the correct colour sleeve or alphanumerics.

 

[saxondale]

Damage - where do you live?

Not in Australia! The guy selling the OZ Pir says the voltages are all OK for UK but the unit has no BS marks!

I take it you`re in England then, please read the WIKI about Part P, basicly you cant work in bathrooms or kitchens without certifying the work, your obviously not "suitably competant" so get someone who knows what there doing, to do it

 

[ColJack]

saxondale....

and we're off on another "THIS IS HOW PART P WORKS" discussions..

it is my understanding from what I've read that like for like replacements and replacing of damaged cables is not notifiable even in special locations?


since he's only replacing a light switch ( albeit with a fancier, non contact variety.. ) then it's not notifiable.. unless he has to change the cable..


Spark123..

yes they should be sleeved blue, and some prefer to use grey as neutral in new installs to get away from the "black is neutral" mentality

I however prefer to use black and not sleeve it in mixed installs since then the blacks are all neutrals unless sleeved red ( brown ) to signify they are switch wires...

likewise, brown (red) is (was) permanent live, grey (yellow) is (was) switched live and black (blue) is (was) neutral..(or the switched live in a T+E switch drop.. )

untill they set the colour codes in stone in the regs or on site guide then it's personal preference unfortunately..

damage...

you should have at the light then a live feed, neutral feed, and live and neutral out to the lights..

should be easy to do...

take the wire that goes to the lights and connect the red to the L1 ( switched load out ), the black to the neutral ( N ).. earth ( sleeved yellow and green ) to the earth ( E )

the other wire connect the red to the live in ( L ), the black to the neutral ( N ) with the other black.. and the earth ( sleeved green and yellow ) to the earth ( E )

 

[Spark123]

Spark123..

I however prefer to use black and not sleeve it in mixed installs since then the blacks are all neutrals unless sleeved red ( brown ) to signify they are switch wires...

Even when using black as neutral you should sleeve it blue when using harmonized cables. Otherwise you will have brown phase and black neutral.

 

[ColJack]

but even if you sleeve it blue on the new cable, the old one will still be black so still have brown phase and black neutral at the joint..

or if you sleeve the old one at this end as well, you should sleeve it the other which then leads you all round the house to do all the neutrals..

damage...

heres a quick sketch of what you should end up with...