Yale Premium Alarm Hsa6400 Wirefree Alarm Kit

[mdf290]

After all this time I still can't get my head around having a business that CHARGES to fit a DiY system that can be bought in most DiY shops!

Simple equipment. low cost and dealing with customers who probably read only the hype on the box and are un-aware of the compromises that result from the use of one way comms.


This is interesting reading......

http://www.pyronix.com/enforcer-wireless-control-panel.php[/QUOTE]

Oh dear oh dear read the small print. To conserve power the supervisory messages are sent in LOW power mode...
methinks defeat grasped from the jaws of victory.
What could have been a coupe de'grace becomes . . . .

A sales gimmick....

Nor only that but while trying to describe a feature they have been unable to hide the fact that transmitting and recieving leads to compromised battery life in the sensors.

Go away on hols for 3 weeks and come back to find half the sensors dropped out of the system in your absence...

not good.

Why not keep things as simple as they already were with appropriate battery changes and enough sensors placed so that if one sensor does not send a message another will.

Not rocket science.
This panel represents an answer to a question that consumers never asked but sales staff invented for them..

Are you on commision Bernard?

 

[mdf290]

Hype on the box? lol

Where is the 'HYPE' Bernard?

 

[Europlex]

Grade 2. Medium risk:
This is first level that will be recognised by insurers and covers the majority of domestic & low value commercial premises. Required as a minimum for Police-calling systems

Something you can't sell as an option.

 

[mdf290]

Grade 2. Medium risk:
This is first level that will be recognised by insurers and covers the majority of domestic & low value commercial premises. Required as a minimum for Police-calling systems

Something you can't sell as an option.

That is absolutely correct.
Sadly for Grade2 installers the truth is that your neighbours ears cannot differentiate between the sound of a grade2 alarm at 1am or a DIY alarm, thereby making both exactly the same in terms of a bells only system response.
They only make a noise EXACTLY the same as each other...
Do you think a burglar once he has activated a Yale alarm will hang around because the siren going off isn't grade 2?

 

[Europlex]

After all this time I still can't get my head around having a business that CHARGES to fit a DiY system that can be bought in most DiY shops!

Simple equipment. low cost and dealing with customers who probably read only the hype on the box and are un-aware of the compromises that result from the use of one way comms.


This is interesting reading......

http://www.pyronix.com/enforcer-wireless-control-panel.php[/QUOTE]

I think the Texecom one is better, I did a link to that didn't I?

 

[mdf290]

Each wireless device on the Enforcer system, including movement detectors is a transmitter and a receiver. The wireless technology used on the Enforcer system holds a significant advantage over one way and some two way wireless products currently available on the market:
1) All wireless devices know when the system is armed and disarmed.
Armed: All including movement detectors are permanently awake, making the protection much more secure.
Disarmed: The detection component of the movement detectors is disabled, preserving battery power. However, the detectors still communicate with the control panel via low power supervision messages.
Alarm Condition: During an alarm condition each activation of the movement detectors (PIR and DT) is transmitted to the ARC and user as well as registered in the memory log. This is only possible because detectors in the Enforcer system never sleep after activated as other products from most other brands would do, therefore compromising security.
2) The Enforcer 2-way wireless system allows the implementation of the Double Knock feature for every wireless movement detector (PIRs and DTs). This feature is normally found on wired systems only and is used to reduce false alarms on difficult installations.


Why is point 1) an advantage? In a one way system constantly operating the sensors have NO NEED to know whether the system is armed or not...

Point 2 again is of dubious merit. On systems that do not suffer false alarms and are not difficult do not need this feature anyway.

Why the comment about sensors sleeping?

This same company was trumpeting that feature on it's earlier systems.

This is marketing making mugs of punters...

 

[mdf290]

After all this time I still can't get my head around having a business that CHARGES to fit a DiY system that can be bought in most DiY shops!

Simple equipment. low cost and dealing with customers who probably read only the hype on the box and are un-aware of the compromises that result from the use of one way comms.


This is interesting reading......

http://www.pyronix.com/enforcer-wireless-control-panel.php[/QUOTE]

I think the Texecom one is better, I did a link to that didn't I?

I would agree with Europlex here - The richochet idea of forwarding makes more sense than complicating things with two way comms and compromised battery life.

The fact that the system needs more messaging to wake up it's sensors for example when the system is activated makes the systems mathematically more prone to fail.

A detection cycle for a one way device is simply a single report of an event.

The two way system Bernard has pointed to relies on two signals getting through. One to activate the sensor and another to report

All this system will achieve is more fault log entries when the low power management comms fails.

 

[Europlex]

Grade 2. Medium risk:
This is first level that will be recognised by insurers and covers the majority of domestic & low value commercial premises. Required as a minimum for Police-calling systems

Something you can't sell as an option.

That is absolutely correct.
Sadly for Grade2 installers the truth is that your neighbours ears cannot differentiate between the sound of a grade2 alarm at 1am or a DIY alarm, thereby making both exactly the same in terms of a bells only system response.
They only make a noise EXACTLY the same as each other...
Do you think a burglar once he has activated a Yale alarm will hang around because the siren going off isn't grade 2?

One very simple difference is that if a G2 system with Police connection is operated, something will be done about it. Even if it is in the middle of a forest with no neighbours, yours won't.

Perhaps you only sell & install DiY equipment to people with close neighbours (is that a requirement of one of your DiY systems?

 

[mdf290]

Grade 2. Medium risk:
This is first level that will be recognised by insurers and covers the majority of domestic & low value commercial premises. Required as a minimum for Police-calling systems

Something you can't sell as an option.

That is absolutely correct.
Sadly for Grade2 installers the truth is that your neighbours ears cannot differentiate between the sound of a grade2 alarm at 1am or a DIY alarm, thereby making both exactly the same in terms of a bells only system response.
They only make a noise EXACTLY the same as each other...
Do you think a burglar once he has activated a Yale alarm will hang around because the siren going off isn't grade 2?

One very simple difference is that if a G2 system with Police connection is operated, something will be done about it. Even if it is in the middle of a forest with no neighbours, yours won't.

Perhaps you only sell & install DiY equipment to people with close neighbours (is that a requirement of one of your DiY systems?

You are talking here now about a monitored system which I never mentioned but now you have I have found that people are equally as effective as responding as keyholders when they recieve a call directlly to their mobile from their alarm panel. In fact you could guarantee they would take definate action whereas the Police as you know are not compelled to.

 

[JohnD]

Is there anybody who would like to argue with what I said long, long ago:

The two big advantages of a DIY wireless system like the Yale is that it is cheap (esecially if you buy it from a discount supplier like ironmongerydirect dot com) and that the householder can easily install it himself in an hour or so

The 6400 has advantages like mutiple user PINs, an activity and fault log, and it can phone you and friends and neighbours with a recorded message in the event of an alarm

If those two key advantages are not vital to you, you can buy a more secure system for more money.

 

[Europlex]

Is there anybody who would like to argue with what I said long, long ago:

The two big advantages of a DIY wireless system like the Yale is that it is cheap (esecially if you buy it from a discount supplier like ironmongerydirect dot com) and that the householder can easily install it himself in an hour or so

The 6400 has advantages like mutiple user PINs, an activity and fault log, and it can phone you and friends and neighbours with a recorded message in the event of an alarm

If those two key advantages are not vital to you, you can buy a more secure system for more money.

Ok, fit one of these fantastic all singing and dancing systems, feel safe in the knowledge that the "telecommunicating alarm will ring you when triggered for the ultimate peace of mind"

In say, 6 months, you buy something that requires your household insurance to be 'upped'. Your insurance company requires an alarm system to be fitted and you tell them that you have a system fitted already.
Great they'll say, what company and you have a copy of the service agreement we could see? You do have a service contract don't you?

Oh it's one of those DiY systems, I'm afraid that is not an acceptable system for the cover you now require. You're going to need a Grade 3 system now.

We'll send you details of the requirements for a G3 system for you to look at before our surveyor comes to see you. And it goes on and on.

Don't come back with that doesn't happen, it does. A third party is needed to ................ oh what's the point.

You both carry on in your own sweet narrow minded ways, believing that everything you say/do is never wrong, twisting or ignoring everything that even a person more knowledgeable than both of you put together has to say.

One day I expect your Harrogate branch will no longer be here as has happened elsewhere.

 

[JohnD]

is that ramble meant to be disagreeing with one or more of the points I made?

if so, which one(s)?

 

[alumni]

Oh dear oh dear read the small print. To conserve power the supervisory messages are sent in LOW power mode...

Still spouting your usual nonsense about products you know diddly about eh?

You really are one strange character.

So what is the problem with the supervisory messages sent in low power?

Please do enlighten us.

 

[Europlex]

is that ramble meant to be disagreeing with one or more of the points I made?

if so, which one(s)?

You choose

 

[JohnD]

what ?