Telford Tempest unvented cylinder resonance/vibration noise

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I have recently had a new Telford Tempest Unvented cylinder installed by my plumber and am now suffering noisy vibrations/resonation that sound like a whirling helicopter as soon as the hot water is switched on. This only stops when the central heating is switched on. The buzzing noise seems to be coming from the heat exchanger coil inside the cylinder. I have tried changing the pump speed but the noise seems to be independent of that.

My plumber has fitted an automatic bleed as he thought it could be due to trapped air in the system but this has had no effect.

I am not a plumber but would appreciate any thoughts ideas on how to resolve this.
 
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Its difficult for me to think of any obvious causes if its been installed correctly.

Is the installer qualified to fit unvented cylinders and has he completed the Benchmark Certificate?

Of course its his responsibility to install it and that includes in a way that operates correctly without any noise.

Can you answer the questions above and post a photo of the pipework around he cylinder?

Tony
 
If the installer fitted he cylinder according to the best practice he would have fitted a gate valve which can be used to balance the coil flow against the heating flow.

Did he do that and if so what effect does adjusting that VERY slowly.

If he did not then I classify him as a nupty. In fact I would fit two so that the cylinder could be isolated without draining the heating.

Tony
 
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I think agiles right if the benchmark certificate isnt filled out or its incorrect this could be the cause of your problems :)
 
Yes, can see the pics. Your plumber isn't a fan of using pipe clips is he? I can only see one on that whole installation. I know it's not possible to do it on the rises up the cylinder but a few more around the walls and floor would have been good to see, both for support of the pipework which is all hanging off the cylinder fittings, and because it would have helped to dampen the vibrations you're suffering with. The pressure relief is also incorrectly installed and he's got gate valves on a high-pressure supply, gate valves should be used on low-pressure systems only, these should be full-bore lever valves or similar.

As to the problem you've actually asked about, turning down the gate valve immediately below the automatic air vent until the noise stops may help, however it will also have the effect of reducing the flow through the coil, meaning that your cylinder will take longer to heat up. Fitting a water shock arrestor rated to heating temperatures, or a small expansion vessel as suggested in the other post, should help as well, although I don't see how you reduce the pressure in the coil without reducing the pressure in the rest of the system. It's a bit concerning that you have to do this though

So, all in all, it seems you've been supplied a cylinder that has an inherent design fault, and had it installed by someone who wasn't terribly good. Not a great combination unfortunately
 
I didn't read all the replies but I know what the problem is...

You need a gate valve putting on either the flow or return pipe to the cylinder. If you read the instructions it may mention that in certain circumstance a balancing valve needs fitting to reduce the flow slightly to reduce vibration, resonance etc.

If a gate valve has been fitted, close it very slightly, or open it slightly...
 
There shouldn't be an isolation valve between the safety group and the cylinder inlet. Thats very naughty, it needs removing pronto. Although probably leak at some point anyway, being a gate valve on mains pressure, doh! :rolleyes:
 
Regarding mickyg comment. I am not a plumber so are you referring to the gate valve in the picture? Sorry not sure what you mean by " between the safety group and the cylinder inlet." If so can you please explain the problems/issues with having a gate valve there. Is it a safety issue?

Leakydave refers to that if its same valve and suggests I adjust it?
 
The gate valve MickyG is referring to is the one on the floor on the incoming mains just after the elbow that brings the pipe across the front of the cylinder, and before the tee up into the cylinder. Yes it is a safety issue as, when closed, it isolates all the safety valves from the cylinder, meaning that in an overheat situation the water has nowhere to go. If the cylinder were to overheat with that valve closed it would explode and demolish your house.

The gate valve LeakyDave is referring to is the one immediately below the automatic air vent half way up the cylinder.

All in all it's a fairly poor installation with many faults, some worse than others. Just out of interest, where is the pressure relief pipe terminated?
 
The gate valve MickyG is referring to is the one on the floor on the incoming mains just after the elbow that brings the pipe across the front of the cylinder, and before the tee up into the cylinder. Yes it is a safety issue as, when closed, it isolates all the safety valves from the cylinder, meaning that in an overheat situation the water has nowhere to go. If the cylinder were to overheat with that valve closed it would explode and demolish your house.

The gate valve LeakyDave is referring to is the one immediately below the automatic air vent half way up the cylinder.

All in all it's a fairly poor installation with many faults, some worse than others. Just out of interest, where is the pressure relief pipe terminated?

Is the photos able to answer as not sure!!
 
MickyG's valve is the one almost off the bottom of the shot in the fourth pic, LeakyDave's is the one in the middle of that pic. The pressure relief pipework is the 22mm pipework that comes off the tundish (black plastic thing) in the middle of the first pic. Trace where it goes and find the other end, then take a pic, just for my amusement (the rest of the installation isn't great with a couple of dangerous bits there so I'm wondering whether this has been done incorrectly as well...)

Was your installer G3 registered to install unvented cylinders? Did you see his qualification card? If he was then he should know better, if he wasn't then it explains the poor standard of work
 
Just thought I would update everyone having spoken to Telford. They claim this problem can occur on big systems and advised me to put a balancing valve between the flow and return. I did this and this has resolved the problem. I only opened the gate valve slightly when the vibrations started and immedately system seemed to be fine
 

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