Why do we need negotiators?

[blightymam]

Lets ignore that such a drastic change should have been a super majority (eg. 2/3 majority) for it to go through, and look at what has happened since the ref. They have been ignoring calls to stay in the single market, even though numerous pro-brexit voices pre-ref said we would stay in it. Then there is the fact that May has been looking to use Henry VIII powers to by-pass Parliament to make legislative changes. How is that not "steamrollering"?

All these things ignore the fact that they are going against the wishes of the majority of the population: Those who voted to stay in the EU don't want this, and those that voted to leave want different levels of leave.

The way its been going, the political inertia feels like the run up to the Iraq war: No matter how stupid it is, we'll do it anyway. Nothing new of course, but it is another extreme example.

Woody seems to want us to pretend that its all going to be fine, when the evidence says otherwise. Democracy, rationalism, and basic decency leads me and others to object to Brexit because we care for our country.

So what have you done about it? Have you written to your MP? Protested? Anything? Or just objected here on a forum?

I think Woody's point isn't about pretending it's going to be fine, it's about getting behind your country and making the best out of a rubbish situation. Am not sure how someone gets behind their country and make the best of it tho, perhaps the point is really to just stop moaning about something that isn't going to change?

 

[wobs]

So what have you done about it? Have you written to your MP? Protested? Anything? Or just objected here on a forum?

All of the above.

 

[blightymam]

All of the above.

Good on ya.
Did it change anything?

 

[motorbiking]

How can WTO rules apply to individual countries within EU, without applying to the EU as a whole?
The EU is a democratic organisation and can take account of individual member countries requests to amend their policies to suit specific circumstances. They have proven this time and time again.

The question posed was why negotiate our exit if we have nothing left to discuss given the requirements (price) associated with what we want. It is repeatedly said that the EU won't miss trade with the Uk as it's a small %age of overall EU trade. Unlike the Uk which is significantly depending on EU trade currently. However the EU is a union of nations and each one individually is impacted differently by brexit. When it comes to handing out a punishment to the Uk they won't agree so easily.

If the Uk trades with the EU on WTO rules, gets no good will payment for an ongoing relationship and has a low tax neighbour on its door step. Each will be impacted very differently

 

[^woody^]

Woody seems to want us to pretend that its all going to be fine,

Instead of making notes on avoidance, you need to make notes of what is actually written. And then read your notes.

I never made any statement about it being fine. What I wrote was that Brexit is happening, and instead of whining on about EU want this, EU said that, The Guardian reported this, the left wing says that.

Why can't people like you just get behind the UK instead of getting behind our competitors or the other parties in the negotiation against the UK?

Why are you so intent on dwelling on every single bit of commentry that the EU has the upper hand and the EU will benefit from any negotiation, and that the UK is crap and the UK are losers?

Why are you not supporting the UK?

Cut and past this into your notes .... "The UK is leaving the EU. I can't stop that. For how long am I going to moan about something I can't change, rather than deal with it and get behind my country?"

 

[Judy in the sky]

Why are you so intent on dwelling on every single bit of commentry that the EU has the upper hand and the EU will benefit from any negotiation, and that the UK is crap and the UK are losers?

Why are you not supporting the UK?

Simple Woody, the remoaniacs have no pride in the UK. During a time of war they would be conscientious objectors and rather be kept in prison than do anything for their country.. Either that or ,, perhaps they just are not British to start with? Perhaps they are in fact , immigrants with nothing to offer the UK ? You know some of them seem to spend all day on here,, so you just know they ain't working.

 

[Deleted member 63160]

Cut and past this into your notes .... "The UK is leaving the EU. I can't stop that. For how long am I going to moan about something I can't change, rather than deal with it and get behind my country?"

Amen.

 

[noseall]

It's perhaps a pity that the press, the politicians, the banks, the business leaders, and all the others that spread the word, do not share your enthusiasm. We also have a guileless, spineless and chaotic government reluctantly negotiating our exit from the EU.

You may find this odd, but because of the lack of anything..... ANYTHING positive spoken about Brexit, is it any wonder people are pessimistic. The only people that are remotely optimistic about it are the RWR on DIYnot FFS!

Give us something positive.......PLEASE?

 

[noseall]

Why are you so intent on dwelling on every single bit of commentry that the EU has the upper hand and the EU will benefit from any negotiation, and that the UK is crap and the UK are losers?

I actually believe that we should just say F' em. What would be the consequences?

 

[Corgigrouch GTi]

Give us something positive.......PLEASE?

OK then, when we leave the EU and there is no longer free movement, a portion of the EU folk here will decide to return home to their countries. Many of these people rent their homes and so as there is less demand for rented accomodation, rents will either stabilise or reduce... Some landlords, especially those at the lower end of the market will decide to off load their potfolio, making houses at the mor affordable end of the market available for first time buyers to buy.... Taking them out of rented accomodation too and into their first mortgaged home... Now, given that many of these houses are now in need of moderniseation, these first time buyers may well decide to have builders in to do the work... and call Mr Noseall to do the work. How can they afford to do this? well, given that the cost of lower paid jobs are held down by a glut of labour, then the wages of those who remain will rise as staff become more valuable, they will pay more tax. Granted the wage bill will rise for Mr Noseall construction but your guys will be better off and pay more tax but you will also have more work to do and will command a higher price for your superb quality work and you will pay more tax, all this tax goes to the exchequer where (If we keep an eye on the government) there is more money for services, care for the Senile old farts like Johnmhong and the like. Some of your guys may have an idea for a business which would make products that would sell across the world, given the low pound, would give them a jump start to their new business, bringing in the foreign currency that we need and without the regulations issues by the EU to small businesses (Large businesses are more able to absorb such costs) business is good and they can employ staff at a good wage....How is this not positive?

I'm already looking at going back to manufacturing..

 

[^woody^]

I actually believe that we should just say F' em. What would be the consequences?

There is stuff to be negotiated, as there are options which are more preferable than others. But as with any negotiation, we need to go in with what we want, and the alternative of what we will accept - and what we won't accept.

Again, as in any negotiation, the other side would know the alternatives available, and what deal they would prefer.

I'm no expert, but it does seem that WTO tarrifs are the least preferable for both sides. That's not to say WTO tarrifs would be a disaster, but just that they are least preferable. As it's been stated by some politicians, no deal may well be better than a crap deal, so the option of walking away should be on the table. And IMO, that would include not paying any so called, "divorce bill".

There is nothing to be lost in the negotiation, that's for sure. As long as our negotiators keep their cool and not give in for the sake of any old deal.

 

[^woody^]

Give us something positive.......PLEASE?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-pol...high-commissioner-uk-a-bit-gloomy-over-brexit

 

[EFLImpudence]

Mr. Downer.

 

[Roger928]

care for the Senile old farts like Johnmhong and the like

Senile ole farts like johnd etc should retire to Venezuela.
Its a socialist utopia apparently.

 

[Judy in the sky]

I actually believe that we should just say F' em. What would be the consequences?

The only downside I can see by saying F' em, is actually a positive for the UK. It's a big downside for the EU. They'll have to find an extra 10 billion ,(estimated) out of the main net contributors annual budgets. Yep let's see Germany and France squirm. What's the worst they can do if we do tell em to stuff their Brexit bill ? Absolutely sweet FA.. (probably place a couple of trawlers blockading the entrance to Calais for a few days)