Interesting Regulation of Yesteryear

[Diver Fred]

And was this "edict" based on anything other than ignorance or superstition?

I don't know how thick the sleeving is (has anybody here ever cut it away to find out?), but the starting position is L & N pins with a csa of about 25mm².

Whatever the cause(s) of overheating plugs and sockets there may be, I very much doubt it's insufficient current carrying capacity of the pins.

The edict was most likely based one the results of the in-house testing in the companies own independent test lab's. At the time the company had plenty of spare cash; the testing was probably an industry year project for their sponsored university students. They probably did cut the pins up to find out how thick the insulation was/is (it's probably thicker now than then, mid '70's).
It may not be completely due to the CSA of the pins but also related to the contact area of the pin and receptacle.

Certainly the company's electricians visited every site and changed all the unsheathed pin plugs.

 

[morqthana]

I suspect that most manufacturers still quote the old 240 volt figures for wattages of their products where they think they can get away with it as their headline statement, perhaps they should be taken to task and if quoting only one figure or headlining one figure it should be at the official "European" 230 volt equation?

I'd rather take to task people who persist in using the term "official European 230V" instead of "official UK 230V".

 

[pete01]

I'd rather take to task people who persist in using the term "official European 230V" instead of "official UK 230V".

Yes 230v v 230v annoys me too.

 

[morqthana]

The problem is some items the current increases with increased voltage and with others it drops. Anything with a switched mode power supply the current is likely to drop as the voltage raises.

So with a cooker, with an induction hob, which way will current go with voltage?

As I see it there are two ways to approach this:

1) Pick a random cooker, or cookers, with an induction top and resistive oven(s), calculate the total loads at the extremes of the voltage range, apply diversity, see what circuit design is needed at each extreme, and say "I really, really, do not see what the issue is".

2) Just say "I really, really, do not see what the issue is".

 

[morqthana]

It may not be completely due to the CSA of the pins but also related to the contact area of the pin and receptacle.

Unchanged.

 

[morqthana]

What's with the Photo bucket stuff?

You posted this:

my divorce with Photobucket,

I wondered what it was about so searched for other posts from you mentioning Photobucket, and found these

Photobucket excellent.

Now Photobucket is phukced.

I was curious about the journey from "excellent" to "phucked" and "divorce".

 

[securespark]

Got you.

It was a long time ago!

 

[mikehammer69]

..

 

[ericmark]

I remember the signs "Danger 440 volt" everywhere as an apprentice, but across two phases of a three-phase for a single phase of 230 volts is 400 volts, 240 volts are 415 volts and only at 250 volts would it be 440 volts. So in my lifetime (I am 75) it has never been a nominal voltage of 440 volts.

Today we have a harmonised voltage across Europe, nothing to do with the common market, unless some get their way to increase the permitted variation in voltage.

The problem is 216.2 to 253 volts is being used to trip solar inverters and EV chargers the latter as a loss of PEN detection device. The limit for exposed parts is 50 volts, but for an EV it has been allowed to go to 75 volts in the main so it can trip by detecting out of voltage so if the voltage range is extended.
1) All solar inverters and EV charging points will need modifying.
2) The EV charging points will need a different method to detect loss of PEN. Or TN-C-S will need banning.

 

[securespark]

I don't know how thick the sleeving is (has anybody here ever cut it away to find out?), but the starting position is L & N pins with a csa of about 25mm².

Whatever the cause(s) of overheating plugs and sockets there may be, I very much doubt it's insufficient current carrying capacity of the pins.

I have just cannibalised an older plug from the 90s.

I don't have any accurate measuring gear, just a tape measure.

The thickness of the plastic sleeve is <1mm.

 

[ericmark]

I must have loads of plugs which have been used with a near 3 kW load, most have worked without a problem, some however have failed, and I look at them, and wonder why?

The fuse should be sand filled, to BS 1362 but if I look at pictures of a genuine fuse and a counterfeit fuse, I am not convinced I would spot the counterfeit, and the main difference is how hot the fuse outer will get.

So we have heat generation in the fuse, and in real terms we simply don't know how much.

Even the colour of the plug will change how hot it will get, but in real terms it is a load of items all added together which will mean one plug can and another can't take the load. It used to depend on the gauge of the silver foil on the cigarette packet, but today I use new fuses when one ruptures.

But it is not current carrying capacity, it is the heat carrying capacity, which is also linked to time.

I remember complaining about the formula to work out if a semiconductor has enough cooling, and the lecturer from Russia explained how much harder if we had to work out how long it would take to overheat.

He explained how he had complained about the heat sink not being large enough, so was told to work out how long it would take to overheat, he had worked out it would take around 2 hours, and was told that was OK, it only took the rocket ½ hour to get to the USA.

Looked at his face, but could not see a tongue in his cheek!

 

[securespark]

 

[morqthana]

Yes 230v v 230v annoys me too.

 

[ebee]

Yes 230v v 230v annoys me too.

I think the question related to was the "official 230v" UK or European or both (or neither) .
OK what is the answer then - my take on it is I`m happy to be it considered both - mind you I am just as happy for UK voltage to be considered 240v (for single phase of course).

No doubt some will slap me down and offer me corrective surgery!

 

[ebee]

Actually if we consider further we could decide to nominate the "Official World Voltage of Single Phase as 1000v +/- 100%" in the hope of making almost everyone happy