Tories promise new minimum wage £10.50 ph .....but there is a catch!

Notch7 · 2 Oct 2019

Ihavenojob said:
Not all people on benefits are the same, some (most) cope, others don't, so is it the benefit system at fault, or a minority of claimant's can't prioritise ?

The examples I mentioned are caused by a deliberate toxic attitude by the benefits system designed to cause harm.

Look at PIP assessors -a privatised system, the assessors are trained to reject applications.
We know thats true because over 50% win on appeal.

The benefits system was broken, it made it difficult for people to work, because many ended up worse off.

But please dont just assume that because some dont prioritise but could manage, then conflate that as though everybody on benefit are scroungers.
It is a stereotyped argument desinged to incite hatred against people on benefits.

There are millions that are in work suffering poverty.
And there are many that go hungry.

Why do you think schools offer free breakfast or after school meal clubs -because parents cant afford the food.

There are many people that refuse to go to food banks because they are too proud.

Im happy to have a sensibke debate about benefits, but lets drop the stereotyped, Daily Mail propaganda.

motorbiking · 2 Oct 2019

Any safety net, whether free NHS of out of work benefits will be abused. Its very hard to stop that. But you only have to look at the incentives a parent has not to work. If you have kids and are on benefits and want to try to do 10-15 hours a week, you are effectively working for 50p an hour, once you account for the reduction.

SirGalahad · 2 Oct 2019

A private system will be abused as well, Moral Hazard.

Focusing on the negatives is for political purposes only.

If you have 99.999% uptime but focus on the 0.001% then it shows that your misplacing your efforts.

The problem with Universal credit is it needs better marginal rates for people working variable hours. Its not flexible enough so in trying to penalise the work shy it harms those wanting to work more but being discincentivised.

Also we live in a developed first world nation, why do so many want the standards of third world nations?

Ihavenojob · 2 Oct 2019

Notch7 said:
The examples I mentioned are caused by a deliberate toxic attitude by the benefits system designed to cause harm.

So the social are victimising certain individuals then ?

Notch7 · 2 Oct 2019

Ihavenojob said:
So the social are victimising certain individuals then ?

Toxic agenda.

Do a google for PIP assessor lies .....there are endless links on google.

The way the UK treats vulnerable people is like the third world

Two thirds of appealsinvolve lying assessors
Last week, the two-month investigation revealed how assessors working for the outsourcing companies Capita and Atos – most of them nurses – had repeatedly lied, ignored written evidence and dishonestly reported the results of physical examinations.

The investigation suggested a serious, institutional problem that stretched across the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) and its contractors, whose staff carry out face-to-face assessments of eligibility for personal independence payment (PIP
https://www.disabilitynewsservice.c...wo-thirds-of-appeals-involve-lying-assessors/

Scope
https://community.scope.org.uk/discussion/54880/pip-assessor-lied-in-assessment

Multiple scerlosis
https://www.mssociety.org.uk/get-in...i-was-virtually-called-a-liar-by-the-assessor

Trust pilot reviews of what assessors are like
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/mypipassessment.co.uk

Downs Syndrome
The Down’s Syndrome Association reported parents of children with the genetic condition being asked how long they’ve had it and how they caught it.
http://belfastmediagroup.com/pip assessor-told-to-rescore-report/

Random
https://www.parliament.uk/business/...ttee/pip-esa-assessments-forum-17-19/?page=61

http://blacktrianglecampaign.org/2017/02/02/pip-investigation-lie-after-lie-after-lie/

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/health-47316973/bereaved-mum-wins-benefit-case-after-daughter-s-death

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ny-report-finds-government-cuts-a8208271.html

Ihavenojob · 2 Oct 2019

Notch7 said:
Toxic agenda.

Do a google for PIP assessor lies .....there are endless links on google.

The way the UK treats vulnerable people is like the third world

Two thirds of appealsinvolve lying assessors
Last week, the two-month investigation revealed how assessors working for the outsourcing companies Capita and Atos – most of them nurses – had repeatedly lied, ignored written evidence and dishonestly reported the results of physical examinations.

The investigation suggested a serious, institutional problem that stretched across the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) and its contractors, whose staff carry out face-to-face assessments of eligibility for personal independence payment (PIP
https://www.disabilitynewsservice.c...wo-thirds-of-appeals-involve-lying-assessors/

Scope
https://community.scope.org.uk/discussion/54880/pip-assessor-lied-in-assessment

Multiple scerlosis
https://www.mssociety.org.uk/get-in...i-was-virtually-called-a-liar-by-the-assessor

Trust pilot reviews of what assessors are like
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/mypipassessment.co.uk

Downs Syndrome
The Down’s Syndrome Association reported parents of children with the genetic condition being asked how long they’ve had it and how they caught it.
http://belfastmediagroup.com/pip assessor-told-to-rescore-report/

Random
https://www.parliament.uk/business/...ttee/pip-esa-assessments-forum-17-19/?page=61

http://blacktrianglecampaign.org/2017/02/02/pip-investigation-lie-after-lie-after-lie/

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/health-47316973/bereaved-mum-wins-benefit-case-after-daughter-s-death

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ny-report-finds-government-cuts-a8208271.html

Jeez, get a life.

JohnD · 2 Oct 2019

Hatejob armours his faulty conscience with a thick layer of deliberate ignorance.

big-all · 3 Oct 2019

Ihavenojob said:
Jeez, get a life.

with respect
i learn about situations from a non biassed point
i dont do social medial or listen to the news
i research any subject before i comment and will use words like " i think " or i believe" as i am not sure but have an opinion
if i comment on a subject and express a definate opinion its fairly factual in an honest non bigoted way
i will always place information in the arena even if it goes against my thoughts as it helps people form full rounded opinions
and assesments are an evil fully designed to save money with little or no regards to the "actual" ability off the person concerned or indeed the desparate often life changing consiquences
yes they can appeal and around 60% will win but they are then often subject to the same after a further assesment after 6 months or a year that by its nature will be after say 3-5 months on from the appeal so no wonder vunerable people are struggling

SirGalahad · 3 Oct 2019

big-all said:
with respect
i learn about situations from a non biassed point
i dont do social medial or listen to the news
i research any subject before i comment and will use words like " i think " or i believe" as i am not sure but have an opinion
if i comment on a subject and express a definate opinion its fairly factual in an honest non bigoted way
i will always place information in the arena even if it goes against my thoughts as it helps people form full rounded opinions
and assesments are an evil fully designed to save money with little or no regards to the "actual" ability off the person concerned or indeed the desparate often life changing consiquences
yes they can appeal and around 60% will win but they are then often subject to the same after a further assesment after 6 months or a year that by its nature will be after say 3-5 months on from the appeal so no wonder vunerable people are struggling

These assessment cost more and dont save money, it would be cheaper and fairer if they were done by the Government but that goes against an ingrained ideology of outsourcing and privatisation.

noseall · 3 Oct 2019

Ihavenojob said:
Jeez, get a life.

Hatejob shows utter contempt for those who are unfortunate to find themselves suddenly out of a job or for those who can not work. Typical brexer - 'who cares'.

SirGalahad · 3 Oct 2019

noseall said:
Hatejob shows utter contempt for those who are unfortunate to find themselves suddenly out of a job or for those who can not work. Typical brexer - 'who cares'.

Its the typical Republican voter, Its worked in the US where the uninformed on a diet of right wing news vote to have no healthcare, no worker rights, pay more tax.

Trump cut taxes on the super rich but raised them on everyone else.

Ihavenojob · 3 Oct 2019

noseall said:
Hatejob shows utter contempt for those who are unfortunate to find themselves suddenly out of a job or for those who can not work. Typical brexer - 'who cares'.

You mean those like notchy who find themselves at a loose end, so spend all day (& a lot of the night ) trawling the 'net for articles to back up their flawed argument. People are assessed, some have benefits cut, some have benefits raised, some stay the same. Hard luck stories make good news, but the fact is, and the point I'm trying to make , is that a vast number of benefit claimants (possibly the majority) get by on what they get, and if they can, then why are others in trouble and relying on food banks and other charities ? And yes, I am a typical Brexer who cares.

Vinty · 3 Oct 2019

To avoid controversy these assessments carried out by Maximus on behalf of the DWP should be video recorded.
That would mean it would be fairly straightforward to find out who is telling the truth, yet the DWP and it's private contractors are reluctant to do this.
The reason that police interviews are now recorded is because of complaints that the police were forcing confessions from suspects, because interviews are now routinely recorded both police and suspects are protected.

SirGalahad · 3 Oct 2019

Ihavenojob said:
You mean those like notchy who find themselves at a loose end, so spend all day (& a lot of the night ) trawling the 'net for articles to back up their flawed argument. People are assessed, some have benefits cut, some have benefits raised, some stay the same. Hard luck stories make good news, but the fact is, and the point I'm trying to make , is that a vast number of benefit claimants (possibly the majority) get by on what they get, and if they can, then why are others in trouble and relying on food banks and other charities ? And yes, I am a typical Brexer who cares.

But you dont care, which is fine, but just admit to it. You are bitter, angry uninformed person who thinks everyone on benefits is defrauding the Gov, those using the NHS are health tourists, our country is full of illegal and a few legal immigrants. Our Police is soft on criminals and our teachers are all Lefty homosexuals, you have worked all your life to see it all given away.

Ihavenojob · 3 Oct 2019

SirGalahad said:
You are bitter, angry uninformed person

Im not bitter or angry, as for uninformed, I take on board what is relevant to me.

SirGalahad said:
everyone on benefits is defrauding the Gov,

If you believe that, that's your prerogative, I don't think that, and never said so.

SirGalahad said:
Our Police is soft on criminals

Police have little influence over the way criminals are punished.

SirGalahad said:
you have worked all your life to see it all given away.

Hardly. spent first five years at home with my parents & siblings, then 12 years at school, haven't worked for a few years, and hopefully in about 12 years (and rising) I can have my pension, so possibly worked 2/3rds of my life at tops.

Tories promise new minimum wage £10.50 ph .....but there is a catch!

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