1 set of LED's not working

[Twin Dad]

Morning All,

Can anybody advise on the this.

I have 1 set of 6no 240v LED spots that are not working. The lamps are 2 way switched by switches at different sides of our dinning area (1 of these is a dimmer, Varilight, trailing edge).

• Everything else on that circuit is working OK.
• I have have tested the flex to the lamps with a tester stick, no power.
• I have checked the connections in the switches. All seem OK.
• I have tested the voltage across the switches - Common and L/L1 and I have 240v across the switch. The voltages moves from L to L1 or vice-a-versa as I would expect if I toggle the other 2 way switch.

My next step will be to find an electrician to re-check what I have tested plus whatever additional testing they are able to perform to try and track down the fault.

If it comes to it that we need to access cables, this will mean either pulling the fittings from the ceiling (cosmetic damage to the plasterboard) which doesn't guarantee access to the correct area or lifting the *sighs* T&G flooring in the room above, currently the nursery to our 7 month old twins.

Questions:

1. Is there anything else I can do/check look for a fault?
2. I'm able to lift the T&G if I have to. Any tips for getting the light fittings out of the ceiling with minimal damage?
3. Any other suggestions on next steps?

Thanks in advance.

 

[bernardgreen]

(1 of these is a dimmer, Varilight, trailing edge)

Replace the dimmer with normal switch.
If the light work then the dimmer is faulty. ( most probably reason for no lights )
If the lights still do not work then first check you have wired the switch correctly. If it is correctly wired and none of the lamps work then time for an electrician,

NOTE tester sticks are not reliable and can ( often do) give false indications. Very hazardous if it shows no voltage when the circuit is Live.

 

[terryplumb]

you stated that you had checked the "flex " to fitting ,and there was no voltage , so I assume you have removed at least one fitting from the ceiling.?? so can you drop the other 5 fittings and post pics ? with a bit of luck the cables coming thru may bring with them the connectors / junction boxes so you can examine further.

 

[Twin Dad]

Thanks Bernard, that had crossed my mind, I will give it a go.

Terry, the flex is inside the the fitting, when you un-screw/pop out the LED lamp, the lamp hangs on the flex. You can do this without removing the rest of the fitting from the ceiling. I'll try a photo.....

 

[Twin Dad]

You can just make out the black flex inside the fitting.

 

[terryplumb]

thanks got that ,but if you remove the actual fitting from the ceiling it will reveal more ,and possibly ,give access to the cables / jb's. as BG said above those testers are not brilliant ,do you have a multi meter ?. if you can be sure that you have 230/240 volts across the switches by measuring the voltage ,then the switches can be ruled out .it is more likely a problem with the switch or the conductors connections to them, but of course not exclusively .By the way I assume we are talking about lights that have been working normally for some time ,and suddenly you turn them on and they are not working ??

 

[Twin Dad]

thanks got that ,but if you remove the actual fitting from the ceiling it will reveal more ,and possibly ,give access to the cables / jb's. as BG said above those testers are not brilliant ,do you have a multi meter ?. if you can be sure that you have 230/240 volts across the switches by measuring the voltage ,then the switches can be ruled out .it is more likely a problem with the switch or the conductors connections to them, but of course not exclusively .By the way I assume we are talking about lights that have been working normally for some time ,and suddenly you turn them on and they are not working ??

I haven't yet managed to take a fitting out of the ceiling......... Any tips for getting them out with minimal damage appreciated. Yes I have a Multimeter, yes can confirm 240v across the switches. Completely agree on the tester pens....... I use with extreme caution.

Lights have been working fine since install about 2 years ago, just suddenly stopped at once.

Thanks for your help thus far.

 

[terryplumb]

so they worked fine and you switched off , never came back on...I would be focusing on the switch's .re examine all conductors on both switches , make sure all connections are tight ,and re check the voltages on all terminals , you may have overlooked something.

 

[flameport]

Yes I have a Multimeter, yes can confirm 240v across the switches.

If you get 240V across a switch, the switch is either off, broken or both.

 

[333rocky333]

. if you can be sure that you have 230/240 volts across the switches by measuring the voltage ,then the switches can be ruled out

Measuring voltage across a switch would measure 240 volt with it Off or a faulty switch as plameport says.
Measuring voltage across a switch would measure 0 volt with it On
Measuring 0 voltage across a switch in both On and Off positions would indicate No load not connected, possibly a faulty switch or a failed connection to the first light.

In either case LIVE working is not really advisable
As bernard advised try bypassing the dimmer switch, that is the weakest link and possibly not ever compatible with the led lamps

 

[Twin Dad]

Thanks Guys. I will swap out the dimmer tomorrow to see if that changes anything. Fully appreciate the that live working isn't that clever - not something I intend to make a habit off.

 

[333rocky333]

• I have tested the voltage across the switches - Common and L/L1 and I have 240v across the switch. The voltages moves from L to L1 or vice-a-versa as I would expect if I toggle the other 2 way switch.

Suggests that the two way switch is ok and that dimmer possibly not.

Personally I would ISOLATE power, NOTE the dimmer wiring and disconnect, use a connecter block to join together the wires taken from L and common,
Park the wire from L1 safely in a connecter block
Reset the power and the lights should hopefully work as one way from the other 2 way switch, until you can sort out a dimmer if needbe

EDIT as switch has common, L and L1
Rather than common, L1 and L2 sorry

 

[Twin Dad]

Suggests that the two way switch is ok and that dimmer possibly not.

Personally I would ISOLATE power, NOTE the dimmer wiring and disconnect, use a connecter block to join together the wires taken from L1 and common,
Park the wire from L2 safely in a connecter block
Reset the power and the lights should hopefully work as one way from the other 2 way switch, until you can sort out a dimmer if needbe

Thanks. I will try that. I had thought about bypassing the dimmer but I couldn't confidently figure out the treatment of the 2 way wiring in the dimmer as you've described.

 

[333rocky333]

Thanks. I will try that. I had thought about bypassing the dimmer but I couldn't confidently figure out the treatment of the 2 way wiring in the dimmer as you've described.

If possible take a photo or at least write down the colours and connections first just in case.
Also ISOLATE the power

 

[Twin Dad]

If possible take a photo or at least write down the colours and connections first just in case.
Also ISOLATE the power

Yes, I normally take a photo before I start if I need to know how it goes back together and I would absolutely always isolate the power and then test before touch.