Baxi Barcelona - explosive ignition

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Baxi Barcelona, under service contract - in May this year started giving intermittent ‘explosive ignition’ … when it happens gives a seriously loud bang
This boiler had been upgraded to 100HE spec some years ago.

Multiple visits and loads of parts … fault just got worse – was also now failing to ignite and going into Lock out .. every couple of days.
Another load of parts … including upgrading the burner door so new style 1 piece electrode assembly could be fitted. (and replaced several times)
After multiple no -improvement visits – one engineer found electrodes shorting to Air Box door panel … I supplied him with high temp sleeving …. Stopped shorting but still locking out.
After about a dozen visits one Tech noticed that every time it failed to ignite he could see a flash over on back of ignition board … multiple board changes, individually and as a pair with control board.

Lockout frequency increased to every start cycle – so boiler 100% down for 1 week.
Another Tech found that the harness to the transformer had been badly burnt (burner box seal leak ?) .. and all insulation burnt off harness – replaced transformer & harness. Could be as a result of all the work rather than root cause.
After lot of investigation – Tech found electrode wires had been interchanged (presumably during one of many electrode changes) – causing wrong direction of spark – and maybe damage to cct boards. Baxi really should have non-interchangeable plugs on these leads to prevent such a mix up.

Today again another Tech visit – another pair of cct boards and ignition board harness, still the same …. Intermittently boiler fails to ignite on first strike and as you hear each ‘click’ of attempt you can see a flash over on rear of ignition PCB … in area to rear of where electrode connects.
My assumption is electrode failing to arc … the energy is built up and has to dissipate somewhere – and flashes over on back of board.
This flash over may be the cause of damaging the boards – or the effect of damaged boards.

List of parts so far …
Initial fault – Explosive ignition

New burner box door seal
New style ceramic burner
New electrodes (twice)
New flame sensor
New electrode harness
New ignition board

Increased to – also intermittent lock out

New burner box door to allow new style electrodes (folded edge type)
New electrodes (new longer style)
New flame sensor
New condensate trap (new style)
Replaced heat exchanger
Replaced flow thermistor
Replaced Ignition board cct board (twice)
Replaced Control cct board

Increased to 100% lock-out every start (flash over)
Replaced flow thermostat
Replaced Ignition board cct board (twice)
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition transformer
Replaced ignition harness
Replaced main harness

Back to – explosive ignition (flash over)
Replaced Ignition board cct board
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition harness

Fault free for 6 weeks

Back to explosive ignition (flash over)
Replaced Ignition board cct board
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition harness


So significant cost of 10 circuit boards, heat exchanger, burner, burner door upgrade … still ongoing.
Has had 23 Tech visits, 9 different individuals, and more than 60 Hrs on site.

Anybody experienced such a fault – thought I would ask as this is dragging on for so long, about the only items not changed are gas valve and fan.
 
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It's obvious what the fault is as its a common issue with these..
 
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If it's an obvious fault
.. care to describe what it is.
9 GasSafe Tech's and area Lead Tech have been unable to resolve - they have also spent ages on phone to Baxi support.
 
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I'll happily thank any help I get, just not got to that point yet.

I don't intend doing the work .. but if there are known causes I can relay to next Tech (due on Tues)

Assuming it can't be that obvious as Baxi support can't identify it.
They keep pushing guys in direction of earth fault or faulty card.
Earth impedance test is fine.
 
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It does seem that the OP is not attempting DIY repairs if these are true

Baxi Barcelona, under service contract

Multiple visits and loads of parts … fault just got worse

So significant cost of 10 circuit boards, heat exchanger, burner, burner door upgrade … still ongoing.
Has had 23 Tech visits, 9 different individuals, and more than 60 Hrs on site.

It always appears that the qualified technicians are unable to diagnose the fault(s) and seem unable to doe so even with help from the Baxi technical team.

I'd like to help you but forum rules forbid gas advice.

So as a result the IP has a non functional boiler with little apparent hope of getting it fixed while you have the answer which he could pass on to the qualified technicians who cpould then repair the boiler.
 
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So as a result the IP has a non functional boiler with little apparent hope of getting it fixed while you have the answer which he could pass on to the qualified technicians who cpould then repair the boiler.
I guess so yes..
I smell BS..;)
 
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If yoiu mean you smell BS from me .......I have tried to give all the necessary history and confirmed this is all being done by Gas Safe registered engineers, not sure how I can prove this is not BS.

I have the boiler under a full service contract, covers all parts & labour.
They have been on this for 5 months ... and as not fixed .. will be keeping them on it. Contract was renewed in July (with 4 months for free as compensation)

I'll happily admit I put my own heating system in (NuHeat under floor heating with thermal store)... I installed the boiler ... but had CORGI guy connect up the gas, commission & test.
Each year have annual service & test under the contract.
Now it is Gas Safe not CORGI ... keeps things legal.

I work on the system - but downstream of the boiler.
 
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What contract do you have and with whom? Bin it, it will never be ok and will continue to give you issues. 23 visits by these techs and 60 hours?
 
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I have a domestic 12 months Homeserve "Shield Gas Heating" contract.
Has until next June to run.
 
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How do you figure out I am doing this gas work ? .... I have given details of the Gas Safe Techs visits, I have openly & very clearly stated I am not going to touch the gas. More than that I don't see how I can prove this.

I have a full 24x7 parts & labour contract - I have even stated the details of the contract, why would I do the work myself, I am just trying to find a lead to the cause so I can get them to bring this to conclusion.

............. I am not intending to touch the gas side of the boiler ..... I only work downstream of the primary connections - which has no issues.



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Baxi Barcelona, under service contract - in May this year started giving intermittent ‘explosive ignition’ … when it happens gives a seriously loud bang
This boiler had been upgraded to 100HE spec some years ago.

Multiple visits and loads of parts … fault just got worse – was also now failing to ignite and going into Lock out .. every couple of days.
Another load of parts … including upgrading the burner door so new style 1 piece electrode assembly could be fitted. (and replaced several times)
After multiple no -improvement visits – one engineer found electrodes shorting to Air Box door panel … I supplied him with high temp sleeving …. Stopped shorting but still locking out.
After about a dozen visits one Tech noticed that every time it failed to ignite he could see a flash over on back of ignition board … multiple board changes, individually and as a pair with control board.

Lockout frequency increased to every start cycle – so boiler 100% down for 1 week.
Another Tech found that the harness to the transformer had been badly burnt (burner box seal leak ?) .. and all insulation burnt off harness – replaced transformer & harness. Could be as a result of all the work rather than root cause.
After lot of investigation – Tech found electrode wires had been interchanged (presumably during one of many electrode changes) – causing wrong direction of spark – and maybe damage to cct boards. Baxi really should have non-interchangeable plugs on these leads to prevent such a mix up.

Today again another Tech visit – another pair of cct boards and ignition board harness, still the same …. Intermittently boiler fails to ignite on first strike and as you hear each ‘click’ of attempt you can see a flash over on rear of ignition PCB … in area to rear of where electrode connects.
My assumption is electrode failing to arc … the energy is built up and has to dissipate somewhere – and flashes over on back of board.
This flash over may be the cause of damaging the boards – or the effect of damaged boards.

List of parts so far …
Initial fault – Explosive ignition

New burner box door seal
New style ceramic burner
New electrodes (twice)
New flame sensor
New electrode harness
New ignition board

Increased to – also intermittent lock out

New burner box door to allow new style electrodes (folded edge type)
New electrodes (new longer style)
New flame sensor
New condensate trap (new style)
Replaced heat exchanger
Replaced flow thermistor
Replaced Ignition board cct board (twice)
Replaced Control cct board

Increased to 100% lock-out every start (flash over)
Replaced flow thermostat
Replaced Ignition board cct board (twice)
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition transformer
Replaced ignition harness
Replaced main harness

Back to – explosive ignition (flash over)
Replaced Ignition board cct board
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition harness

Fault free for 6 weeks

Back to explosive ignition (flash over)
Replaced Ignition board cct board
Replaced Control cct board
Replaced ignition harness


So significant cost of 10 circuit boards, heat exchanger, burner, burner door upgrade … still ongoing.
Has had 23 Tech visits, 9 different individuals, and more than 60 Hrs on site.

Anybody experienced such a fault – thought I would ask as this is dragging on for so long, about the only items not changed are gas valve and fan.

and its still not fixed :ROFLMAO: , fooking muppets . why are you still paying for the service contract ? theres a bit of a funny smell in the air :cautious:
 
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I can't dispute your view that they are muppets for not fixing ......... but are you reading into some conspiracy regarding your comment there is a 'funny smell' ?

My boiler was under contract when I reported the fault ........ they were working on it when it came up for renewal .... if I cancelled contract it would still be faulty ........ and whenever I have taken a new contract it requires an 'inspection' where they would see the fault.
Then they could exclude that from the cover, or at least make me liable for the cost.

So for me it was sensible to renew the policy while they are 'in repair steps' ............ whether I renew next year is different question.

However just changing contract for example to BG would not give me an instant fix ... after all Baxi support have so far failed to hep Techs identify the fault, which to me seems to a lot more involved - it is certainly not obvious to them.
The Techs are all well experienced Gas Safe Engineers, and presumably Baxi support knows of any 'obvious' issues.
 
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These things are nails yet baxi persist with the awful units in different guises. door seals, sump seal, flue seals, electrodes, pcbs, gas valve, burner, breather, ignition pressure, take your pick.
 
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I can't dispute your view that they are muppets for not fixing ......... but are you reading into some conspiracy regarding your comment there is a 'funny smell' ?

The Techs are all well experienced Gas Safe Engineers, and presumably Baxi support knows of any 'obvious' issues.

I often have serious reservations about the skill level of some working for that kind of firm.

However another RGI here, DP, disagrees with me and says they are all highly skilled.

Just don't see how a band of "highly skilled" engineers can take so long to sort out your boiler!

Tony
 

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