Cedar cladding suppliers

[^woody^]

Hijacking your thread again @23vc Do you reckon clear Cosmo oil extra, or the cedar one? Not sure if the latter is a stain to try and dye other wood to match cedar?

I was about to order £128 of screws from russwood... and they want to charge £17.40 in postage - scoundrels! Will look elsewhere for them now.

Less than 2kg should be the cheapest postage rate @ £6.60. I had a box of 400 off them a few years ago and got charged the low rate. They covered 25m2 IIRC, and I had some left over.

For the oil, I had a tin of clear and cedar and I made a big big mistake of mistakenly using the cedar shade on cedar, and it came out a bland cedar colour, took most of the grain definition away. I had to sand the whole lot down. Use the Clear UV Protection Oil 420 Extra.

 

[^woody^]

I read something (on forums so must be true) that the clear isn’t as good at blocking UV, and the cedar is too dark, and the light oak’s the one to go for.
But who knows, I’ve ordered samples of all 3 so will post a pic when I get ‘em

I would not use a shade, it looks horrible. Clear will last a good few years between coats and I certainly would not like to be looking at stained timber in the meantime. It will take away most of the grain and you wont get the natural shade variances of the planks.

 

[^woody^]

thanks. Reckon it’s worth storing it (flat) in the house for a couple of weeks before oiling, just to give it a bit more of a chance to get a bit drier, or pointless? As I reckon I’ll struggle to get kiln dried.

It will have been drying for up to a year, a few weeks in your front room wont make too much difference, and none to the coating of it.

 

[23vc]

Seeing as this is now the best cladding thread ever, I’ll just add that I was planning on finishing around the windows with ripped sections of the same cladding boards fixed either side and the top. And horizontal joints just butted together rather than mitred. It’s a masonry wall behind it so rain penetration not an issue.
Am I on the right lines?

 

[scbk]

Russwood will also sell you the timber, but I'd think the haulage down to you would kill it

 

[kingandy2nd]

All really useful. Ended up bumping up my order with Russwood to include the orsam oil and some separator strips. Bank account now £258 lighter, but at least the postage was free.

I need about £1,000 worth of cedar so it’s a bit amazing that the fixings treatment is another 25% on the price on top. Worth mentioning here for reference in the ultimate cladding thread

 

[23vc]

You planning to get it treated and fitted when it arrives Andy? Kiln dried seems hard to get but from advice here I reckon I’ll get air dried/green and assess how damp it looks when I get it.
Did you go for the clear osmo?

 

[^woody^]

Seeing as this is now the best cladding thread ever, I’ll just add that I was planning on finishing around the windows with ripped sections of the same cladding boards fixed either side and the top. And horizontal joints just butted together rather than mitred. It’s a masonry wall behind it so rain penetration not an issue.
Am I on the right lines?

Yes you can do that around the windows, and there would be no need to detail a a vertical DPC to prevent water ingress to the wall in your case.

However at the head of the frame, unless you detail a proper head drip and tray (and ventilation gap), there is the chance of water resting on the head timber and running back to the wall or sideways or otherwise causing undesirable staining and premature rot.

For the sides of the opening, the cladding should not butt against the jamb timber but a slight 5-10mm gap left. This is to prevent water soaking in to the end grain by capillary action and causing ugly water staining, and allowing the end grain to dry off quickly. Incidentally, make sure you treat the end grain of all cladding and timber well to prevent this staining occurring on any cut end.

You should really avoid having joints in the cladding, and plan it using single lengths. Cedar is vey stable lengthways, so whether its butt jointed or mitred wont matter too much, but the issue is one of anaesthetics and potential end grain staining which will really stand out.

One other tip, if you are having 50mm external corner pieces (or any vertical timbers really) don't have flat, square cuts on the bottom as this causes the ends to hold water and stain and rot. Either angle the bottom with a single angle cut or four-sided cuts, or in the case of 50mm square timber, you could drill out the centre with a hinge cutter or suchlike and this creates a drip around the edges but preserves the appearance of a square bottom. Remember to treat the end thoroughly - I tend to dip the ends in preservative or end grain treatment and not just rely on the oil coating.

 

[kingandy2nd]

You planning to get it treated and fitted when it arrives Andy? Kiln dried seems hard to get but from advice here I reckon I’ll get air dried/green and assess how damp it looks when I get it.
Did you go for the clear osmo?

I've got to get the house rendered (professionally) first, then the cladding will be the last piece in the puzzle. I've not ordered the wood yet, so I'll do a bit of shopping around. Yeah, I will treat both sides as woody suggest and then fit. I may even fit first to get all the cuts correct, then take down to treat.

I'm a couple of months away of doing the work, but I like to have the stuff ordered in advance and ready for when I need it rather than hitting delays with lead times.

I'd not thought too much about the dried state of the wood. Obviously I would keep it dry with tarps etc my in my mind a naturally dried wood might be better considering that its going to be external cladding. Overly dried wood might change shape once it re-absorbs some moisture, so having something that's dried naturally might be preferable. There's no science behind that logic... just my feelings about external wood.

 

[23vc]

Yes you can do that around the windows, and there would be no need to detail a a vertical DPC to prevent water ingress to the wall in your case.

However at the head of the frame, unless you detail a proper head drip and tray (and ventilation gap), there is the chance of water resting on the head timber and running back to the wall or sideways or otherwise causing undesirable staining and premature rot.

For the sides of the opening, the cladding should not butt against the jamb timber but a slight 5-10mm gap left. This is to prevent water soaking in to the end grain by capillary action and causing ugly water staining, and allowing the end grain to dry off quickly. Incidentally, make sure you treat the end grain of all cladding and timber well to prevent this staining occurring on any cut end.

You should really avoid having joints in the cladding, and plan it using single lengths. Cedar is vey stable lengthways, so whether its butt jointed or mitred wont matter too much, but the issue is one of anaesthetics and potential end grain staining which will really stand out.

One other tip, if you are having 50mm external corner pieces (or any vertical timbers really) don't have flat, square cuts on the bottom as this causes the ends to hold water and stain and rot. Either angle the bottom with a single angle cut or four-sided cuts, or in the case of 50mm square timber, you could drill out the centre with a hinge cutter or suchlike and this creates a drip around the edges but preserves the appearance of a square bottom. Remember to treat the end thoroughly - I tend to dip the ends in preservative or end grain treatment and not just rely on the oil coating.

Excellent advice, much obliged

 

[23vc]

Looking at the osmo UV oil, apparently you need to leave the cedar exposed for 3 months before oiling it. Which is fine, but means I can’t oil the rebates bits or the rear of the boards as it’ll all be fitted by the time it’s oiled.
Anyone done the same/different?

 

[^woody^]

I did mine with a couple of weeks of bringing the cladding home. Two coats rear and three front before fitting.

It would be impossible to coat it properly once fitted, and I did not want it exposed before it got protected.

 

[23vc]

I did mine with a couple of weeks of bringing the cladding home. Two coats rear and three front before fitting.

It would be impossible to coat it properly once fitted, and I did not want it exposed before it got protected.

Yeah I reckon I’ll do the same. Can’t see the benefit of leaving it/can’t see the harm in oiling it straight away

 

[^woody^]

IIRC the reason to leave it is for the surface to get some UV and weathering which would then give the oil a better grip. I thought that only applies to resinous timber, which cedar is not.

In hindsight, I wonder if that is why I needed to recoat in two years initially? But either way I would rather that than leave it exposed - which would be impractical and risky in any case.

 

[Notch7]

A couple of points:

Western Red Cedar is generally not kiln dried, it's usually imported shipping dry, which is around 18%
And at timber yards it's mostly stored outside

Brooks Bros, based in Essex - softwood depot is Danbury, are major importers of WRD.

They also stock Siberian larch which is a fantastic cladding product - much harder and heavier than WRC but still naturally durable....although not as durable as WRC.

Creating a cavity behind by fitting vertical battens increases longevity as moisture getting behind the cladding can escape.

European larch is not durable and best avoided.


Bear in mind: cladding can either be stained, in which you have to keep up re decoration cycles, or it can be left untreated in which case the lignin will die and it will turn grey. Sadly areas below soffit overhangs etc stay coloured and some areas will get very water stained, so it takes quite a while before you get an even grey colour all over.



Swan brand decking screws are great for fixing - they have a square drive and a bugle head.

Or you can get small head, torx specially for cladding - which looks far nicer than Pozi csk but is much dearer.