Very stupid to get out of the vehicle in that manner?
Was it heading to a 1000 feet cliff drop?
driving on icy roads
- Thread starter carolg
- Start date
Very stupid to get out of the vehicle in that manner?
Was it heading to a 1000 feet cliff drop?
Sponsored Links
Cat litter? BAD advice. Cat litter is bentonite clay, which is more slippery than snow when wet.
The correct technique is to keep the treads in contact with the snow, which at least gives the tiny amount of snow that squeezes up into the sipes a chance of gripping. If you brake or accelerate too much you break the very weak bond between the snow in the sipes and the surface and you spin or skid. This means keeping the wheels turning at road speed, which also means you still have a chance of steering the car. It follows that more snow can find its way up into the sipes if you're on soft snow or rough iced snow rather than a smooth glassy surface.
Narrow tyres are better because they will have better ground pressure and will force those sipes down into the snow. Wide tyres are a disaster for the opposite reason. Why do you think the little series 2 Land Rover with skinny tyres chugs up the slope past the big fat Range Rover in that Top Gear video?
So as far as technique is concerned, drive in the highest gear you can so that you're delivering less power to the driving wheels. Diesels are better for this thanks to their torque and a front-wheel drive diesel car is better still, because diesel engines are heavier than petrol and the weight will be on the driving wheels. Coming down hill keep the wheels turning, try not to brake, which means choosing the appropriate gear at the top, usually second. Seek out rough surfaces, for example in the middle and sides of the carriageway, away from the hard polished marks left by other cars. If this makes a 10% difference to your grip it might get you up that hill where others have failed.
Finally, momentum is your friend, get a good run up and keep the car moving briskly without applying enough power to spin those driving wheels.
The correct technique is to keep the treads in contact with the snow, which at least gives the tiny amount of snow that squeezes up into the sipes a chance of gripping. If you brake or accelerate too much you break the very weak bond between the snow in the sipes and the surface and you spin or skid. This means keeping the wheels turning at road speed, which also means you still have a chance of steering the car. It follows that more snow can find its way up into the sipes if you're on soft snow or rough iced snow rather than a smooth glassy surface.
Narrow tyres are better because they will have better ground pressure and will force those sipes down into the snow. Wide tyres are a disaster for the opposite reason. Why do you think the little series 2 Land Rover with skinny tyres chugs up the slope past the big fat Range Rover in that Top Gear video?
So as far as technique is concerned, drive in the highest gear you can so that you're delivering less power to the driving wheels. Diesels are better for this thanks to their torque and a front-wheel drive diesel car is better still, because diesel engines are heavier than petrol and the weight will be on the driving wheels. Coming down hill keep the wheels turning, try not to brake, which means choosing the appropriate gear at the top, usually second. Seek out rough surfaces, for example in the middle and sides of the carriageway, away from the hard polished marks left by other cars. If this makes a 10% difference to your grip it might get you up that hill where others have failed.
Finally, momentum is your friend, get a good run up and keep the car moving briskly without applying enough power to spin those driving wheels.
R
RedHerring
Just a comment on coming down hill, as applied to off-road slippery conditions:
Choose lowest gear, thus lowest speed and keep your feet off the pedals, yes off all of them, to maintain traction and restrain speed. Obviously it becomes a judgement call depending on slipperiness of hill.
One rule does not apply to all!
The advice, if you lose traction, in an off-road situation, going down-hill, (assuming you've followed the previous advice) is to accelerate a little to regain traction, but a) you have to be brave to do this and b) I wouldn't advise it on ice.
Also, if you're going uphill and you lose traction and start sliding down again, don't just roll down. Quick dab on the footbrake and clutch, into reverse, feet off the pedals and use reverse to control your down hill speed/traction. Assuming the way behind you is clear, obviously, which gives rise to another point: Don't follow someone up a steep, slippery hill until they've reached the top.
Choose lowest gear, thus lowest speed and keep your feet off the pedals, yes off all of them, to maintain traction and restrain speed. Obviously it becomes a judgement call depending on slipperiness of hill.
One rule does not apply to all!
The advice, if you lose traction, in an off-road situation, going down-hill, (assuming you've followed the previous advice) is to accelerate a little to regain traction, but a) you have to be brave to do this and b) I wouldn't advise it on ice.
Also, if you're going uphill and you lose traction and start sliding down again, don't just roll down. Quick dab on the footbrake and clutch, into reverse, feet off the pedals and use reverse to control your down hill speed/traction. Assuming the way behind you is clear, obviously, which gives rise to another point: Don't follow someone up a steep, slippery hill until they've reached the top.
In my experience, if you lose traction on ice going downhill, there's nothing realistically you can do to recover the situation.
Doesn't mean you should sit back and wait for the crash though
I live at the top of a very long and steep hill and the last time it happened to me I was driving a 3 month old Honda Accord which won't select reverse (electronic lockout not manual) when the car is moving forward so, out of desperation, I held the brake, selected reverse and then accelerated gradually (once I'd released the brake).
It did slow the vehicle marginally but the unexpected bonus was that I was able to steer ... Don't ask me how but it worked.
So, I was gradually sliding fowards down the hill with the wheels driven backwards and able to steer out of danger until I got to the bottom.
The biggest shock was when I got to the bottom and the wheels struck solid ground ... Almost an underwear change
MW
Doesn't mean you should sit back and wait for the crash though
I live at the top of a very long and steep hill and the last time it happened to me I was driving a 3 month old Honda Accord which won't select reverse (electronic lockout not manual) when the car is moving forward so, out of desperation, I held the brake, selected reverse and then accelerated gradually (once I'd released the brake).
It did slow the vehicle marginally but the unexpected bonus was that I was able to steer ... Don't ask me how but it worked.
So, I was gradually sliding fowards down the hill with the wheels driven backwards and able to steer out of danger until I got to the bottom.
The biggest shock was when I got to the bottom and the wheels struck solid ground ... Almost an underwear change
MW
Sponsored Links
So do I.
A main road is at the bottom. Have took off down it a couple of times before we fleeced salt from the council.
There's only one option I find!
Forget about the brakes and hit the hand brake. Have been lucky a few times I guess.
Usually end up sitting broadside at the edge of the road. Works for me anyway.
R
RedHerring
Not a technique I'd advise, but it worked for you on that occasion.
I can understand that the lack of locked front wheels would allow directional control, but the wheels turning in the opposite direction to actual travel
Perhaps the understeer effect Had it been RWD or AWD there would have been an excellent chance of the rear end swapping with the front end.
When faced with "take your hands off the wheel, do nothing and wait" or "try anything no matter how stupid" the human equation and ingenuity is often the difference between safety and disaster.
This is the factor which will always keep pilots on aircraft despite them having been technically unneccessary for a number of years now.
MW
This is the factor which will always keep pilots on aircraft despite them having been technically unneccessary for a number of years now.
MW
B
Bodgeit and scarper ltd
I always go down steep hills on ice in first gear. slightly touching the brakes on and off. If your not used to ice keep clear of it. I get fed up with getting cold hands tying my rope on to cars and pulling them out of a ditch.
What about this pedestrian....you cant help laughing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CT0a-Hgumo&feature=topvideos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CT0a-Hgumo&feature=topvideos
R
RedHerring
Yep, the rear end swaps with the front end and you slip downards off the camber of the road into the kerb.
So do I.
A main road is at the bottom. Have took off down it a couple of times before we fleeced salt from the council.
There's only one option I find!
Forget about the brakes and hit the hand brake. Have been lucky a few times I guess.
Usually end up sitting broadside at the edge of the road. Works for me anyway.
Incidentally, in an off-road situation this is exremely dangerous practice. The hills are often steeper and turning broadside will often induce a rollover.
R
RedHerring
You're welcome to your opinion. Don't neccessarily agree with your reasoning though
Remind me to never go off-roading with you.
No problem.
My off roading experience included racing a VW jetta in my neighbours fields with a mate.
Our prime objective was to roll the vehicle.
Unable to do so I had to lift the car at the sill and rolled it over down the field a few times with my mate still inside. He got out of the car after wards screaming at the top of his voice in delight pumped up with adrenelin.
R
RedHerring
Exactly, turning broadside while going downhill can induce rollover. Continuuing downhill in normal front followed by rear (or even the other way round) is safest.
Sponsored Links
