Hot water temp is 40 Degrees - Ideal Mexico 2 Boiler

[JackK]

Guys, look at post 14
water coming out of the gate valve, will move along that horizontal pipe, will rise to where the AAV is fitted. Then the hot water will need to defy laws of physics for hot water to flow down the vertical 22mm ( guessing it will be at least 600 mm height) pipe side of the cylinder and set up circulation through another hurdle that is the high efficiency indirect coil that is designed for pumped circulation that is lacking here

Thank you dp and the others. It is so difficult to accept that I have wasted hard money on a cylinder and plumbing

I am sorry to repeat myself but this is the final time I ready the question. If I rebend the pipe after the two port valve so there is always a slight fall will gravity push it through the existing coil ?

Bear in mind the water must be travelling quite fast to be able to climb a whole floor in the big white pipe where the tee comes from.

I am scared and nervous of putting money into a pump which might cause air or something else. Any advice so appreciated

 

[DP]

Jack for the last time, you cannot have circulation in the cylinder and pipework you have at present. You can raise the cylinder, do what you like but circulation is not going to be effective
Fit a pump and see what happens. Lose the MV

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I am sorry to repeat myself but this is the final time I ready the question. If I rebend the pipe after the two port valve so there is always a slight fall will gravity push it through the existing coil ?

The consensus of opinion is no, that will still not work satisfactorily. The only way is to install a pump..

I am scared and nervous of putting money into a pump which might cause air or something else. Any advice so appreciated

Well, the decision is entirely yours. You obviously don't need the valve, because without the pump, you presently lack any water circulation. Adding a pump, when the pump is not running, there will still not be any circulation - so the valve serves no pupose.

 

[JackK]

Thank you so much.

Is a more powerful pump in place of what I have at the moment (dab 65/130) swapped for a 8m head also not an option.

I asked before and I was told no. I want to double check this.

In my mind the water must be flowing quite fast to climb another floor so should be able to go round a little bend but obviously not happening which is disappointing

 

[Notch7]

(Needs to be 28mm pipework.) You may then have a chance, but I'm not sure you've got the right cylinder. 22mm Tappings suggest it's only suitable for Fully Pumped systems

the OP has started a thread on the plumbing forum.

one of the early responses was: “the cylinder is not suitable for gravity”

 

[DP]

Thank you so much.

Is a more powerful pump in place of what I have at the moment (dab 65/130) swapped for a 8m head also not an option.

I asked before and I was told no. I want to double check this.

In my mind the water must be flowing quite fast to climb another floor so should be able to go round a little bend but obviously not happening which is disappointing

To pardon the pun, you are stuck in a loop like water the Dab is pumping round the doughnut circuit
Clearly any serious suggestions are falling on deaf ears

 

[DP]

the OP has started a thread on the plumbing forum.

one of the early responses was: “the cylinder is not suitable for gravity”

Jack fails to accept the circulation ( or lack of now) through the cylinder is still gravity on account of the Dab pump

 

[MNW67]

There is one shared flow pipe and one return for hot water and one return for radiators

I was looking for an old post of mine and I found this photo. Are you saying that the pipe joining the pump from the right is the hot water cylinder return. And the pipe joining the pump from above is the central heating return.

 

[DP]

I was looking for an old post of mine and I found this photo. Are you saying that the pipe joining the pump from the right is the hot water cylinder return. And the pipe joining the pump from above is the central heating return.

View attachment 331145

It would seem the pump is on the return and both heating and HW zones are fully pumped. You will have two dedicated pipe runs like two railway lines on the sleepers ( sleepers being the radiators), One pipe takes hot water to the cylinder and radiators, second returns the water to the boiler, water that has given up the heat to be heated in the boiler. If you closed all the radiator valves and cylinder lockshield, pump could burn out as it would be pumping into a stopped system

Jacks system has a single pipe, larger diameter, that takes the heated water from the boiler. This pipe goes round the property and same pipe returns to the boiler. In essence we have a say 50mm pipe loop and boiler and pump are inserted into the loop
Any radiator or the cylinder will have the inlet or the outlet pipes connected to the loop. The radiator pipes will never be 8mm or, 10, hardly ever 15mm even- the inlet pipe often will be connected to top of the radiator and outlet to lower tapping

 

[JackK]

It would seem the pump is on the return and both heating and HW zones are fully pumped. You will have two dedicated pipe runs like two railway lines on the sleepers ( sleepers being the radiators), One pipe takes hot water to the cylinder and radiators, second returns the water to the boiler, water that has given up the heat to be heated in the boiler. If you closed all the radiator valves and cylinder lockshield, pump could burn out as it would be pumping into a stopped system

Jacks system has a single pipe, larger diameter, that takes the heated water from the boiler. This pipe goes round the property and same pipe returns to the boiler. In essence we have a say 50mm pipe loop and boiler and pump are inserted into the loop
Any radiator or the cylinder will have the inlet or the outlet pipes connected to the loop. The radiator pipes will never be 8mm or, 10, hardly ever 15mm even- the inlet pipe often will be connected to top of the radiator and outlet to lower tapping

DP is almost correct

There is one flow pipe (28mm copper far right which then connects into 2 inch / 3 inch steel pipe) for the whole house and hot water. Pump is on return - The magnafilter only cleans half the return sadly

There is one dedicated return for the hot water cylinder which you can see in the picture

At the back of the boiler is another return for the radiator return (I think this is because of pump issue that DP pointed out to allow bypass if all closed)

I have to say the level of knowledge on this forum is far superior to many gas engineers some of whom are manufacturer preferred installers so I am very lucky to have come across this site

 

[MNW67]

It would seem the pump is on the return and both heating and HW zones are fully pumped. You will have two dedicated pipe runs like two railway lines on the sleepers ( sleepers being the radiators), One pipe takes hot water to the cylinder and radiators, second returns the water to the boiler, water that has given up the heat to be heated in the boiler. If you closed all the radiator valves and cylinder lockshield, pump could burn out as it would be pumping into a stopped system

Jacks system has a single pipe, larger diameter, that takes the heated water from the boiler. This pipe goes round the property and same pipe returns to the boiler. In essence we have a say 50mm pipe loop and boiler and pump are inserted into the loop
Any radiator or the cylinder will have the inlet or the outlet pipes connected to the loop. The radiator pipes will never be 8mm or, 10, hardly ever 15mm even- the inlet pipe often will be connected to top of the radiator and outlet to lower tapping

Apols if I have totally got the wrong end of the stick!

But, I think I might have confused things terribly here! Really, really sorry if so. What I meant was that I was looking for an old post of mine on one of Jack's threads. The system in the photo is Jack's system, not mine.

Are you saying that the pipe joining the pump from the right is the hot water cylinder return. And the pipe joining the pump from above is the central heating return.

@JackK Is this what you are saying? Like in this drawing you did which I've just found.

 

[JackK]

Apols if I have totally got the wrong end of the stick!

But, I think I might have confused things terribly here! Really, really sorry if so. What I meant was that I was looking for an old post of mine on one of Jack's threads. The system in the photo is Jack's system, not mine.



@JackK Is this what you are saying? Like in this drawing you did which I've just found.

View attachment 331208

Yes that is my system - I tried to lay it out as best as I could

1 flow and two returns

 

[MNW67]

Yes that is my system - I tried to lay it out as best as I could

1 flow and two returns

Like this annotated photo? Basically, a one pipe system with one flow and two returns.

 

[JackK]

MNW67 - Yes that is my picture...Wish I could repipe it but cant at the moment afford to​

 

[MNW67]

@JackK

I was just hoping to clarify for everyone exactly what you have, so you get the best advice. A picture paints a thousand words!