Hurrah for the UK:US Trade deal!

[JohnD]

"Trump threatens to use US trade talks to force NHS to pay more for drugs"

"Mr Trump has claimed that the high costs faced by US patients are a direct result of other countries’ health services “freeloading” at America’s expense.

Alex Azar, the US Health and Human Services Secretary, has said Washington will use its muscle to push up drug prices abroad, to lower the cost paid by patients in the United States.

"On the foreign side, we need to, through our trade negotiations and agreements, pressure them," Azar said on CNBC."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/05/15/trump-threatens-use-us-trade-talks-force-nhs-pay-drugs/

 

[motorbiking]

Perhaps we could help them with their drug negotiations

 

[sbgasman]

Can you believe it, somebody looking out for their own country,instead of being a 5th columnist.

 

[noseall]

Can you believe it

No.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Just watched Dirty Money on Netflix about American drug companies.

Greedy bastards jacking up the price hugely because insurance companies pay - for those with cover obviously - leading to increased insurance costs just because greedy bastards jacked up the price hugely because ...

 

[SirGalahad]

Just watched Dirty Money on Netflix about American drug companies.

Greedy bastards jacking up the price hugely because insurance companies pay - for those with cover obviously - leading to increased insurance costs just because greedy bastards jacked up the price hugely because ...

It's beyond horrible. But dumb people will argue for that.

 

[SirGalahad]

Can you believe it, somebody looking out for their own country,instead of being a 5th columnist.

I take it you don't know how US drug companies price gouge or how intl trade works.

You really are wet behind the ears if you think that justification is valid.

The top 10 drug companies by sales all have a presence in the US but only half are US owned. So helping them woukdwou actually be helping the US exclusively.

Stick to stuff you know.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Can you believe it, somebody looking out for their own country,instead of being a 5th columnist.

Actually NOT looking out for the country, i.e. the people, but safeguarding the despicable side of capitalism where manufacturing companies are actually just hedge funds.

Some there are fighting it.

 

[Ian H]

So why don't we make our own drugs?

 

[JohnD]

the UK does have several major pharmaceutical companies. But new drugs are patented worldwide, and sold in all, or most countries, either by the patent-holder, or by a licenced maker (in some countries, by unlicenced makers)

Once the patent expires, the drug can be made by any company, and competition brings the price down (but this may not apply in the US, see below).

The UK (and other countries, especially with a universal healthcare system) makes great use of Generic drugs (e.g. Ibuprofen, instead of Nurofen, which is the same thing with a trade name and a higher price).

In the US, drug prices are very high. Most of the "healthcare" industry earns its money by taking a slice of the cost of treatment. In which case the hospital, the prescriber, the pharmacy, the drugmaker, and the insurance company all make more money if the drugs are expensive than if they are cheap. It may also be the reason why US medical treatment includes much more high-tech costly investigations than are considered necessary in other countries.

There are some shocking (or disgusting) examples of US drug pricing. For example http://fortune.com/2017/08/04/martin-shkreli-convicted-pharma-lessons/
and
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/21/...ncrease-in-a-drugs-price-raises-protests.html

 

[SirGalahad]

So why don't we make our own drugs?

Watch dirty money on Netflix - it will be explained simply with real examples.

 

[motorbiking]

The odd thing is.. Even with private medical, you don't get the rush to run tests in the UK, like you do in other countries. There really does seem to be a gravy train mentality, that doesn't exist here.

Rather than moan about subsidising other countries, they might consider adopting our model to squeeze out some of the profiteering.

In the US Pharma sales people have a reputation similar to double glazing sales people here.

 

[SirGalahad]

The odd thing is.. Even with private medical, you don't get the rush to run tests in the UK, like you do in other countries. There really does seem to be a gravy train mentality, that doesn't exist here.

Rather than moan about subsidising other countries, they might consider adopting our model to squeeze out some of the profiteering.

In the US Pharma sales people have a reputation similar to double glazing sales people here.

In the NHS the Dr has no incentive to run more tests than needed. He doesn't make more money. That is changing with the creeping privatisation of the NHS.

In the US the Dr will order a battery of tests even if they are not needed because a) they cover themselves so they don't miss the chance of an obscure illness (statistically insignificant), the paying patient demands it as they paid through the nose for insurance, Many drs have commissions for referrals.

You have a headache in UK the GP will discuss it with you and then offer you meds or something else. In the US you will probably go have an MRI which isn't needed in about 99% of cases.

Then factor in litigious nature of the US and no win no fee lawyers which we seem to be getting more and more of.

The real question is. Why are we following a path which leads to the horrible situation in the US?

 

[motorbiking]

There are downsides though. go to your GP with back ache and depending on how incapacitated you are, you'll be told to take paracetamol or ibuprofen. If its really bad they might give you valium or codeine both reasonably addictive. Unless you have any of the red flags they won't send you for am MRI. Mention the magic words "I have private health care" and they will refer you. Then you will at least see which part of your body is injured an be able to discuss a proper rehab stretching and exercise option that will most likely fix the problem, with someone who really understands the problem.

 

[SirGalahad]

You talk about exceptional cases. The norm is that in most cases you dont need resolution by a specialiast. Also with ongoing cuts more people who need care will not receive it.

The specialists you see privately were all trained in the NHS and most will still work there as well.