Please read up on the joys of the french model you keep promoting as a solution to the problem of the NHS. the french goverment is also burdened by a health care deficit.
NHS R.I.P
- Thread starter ellal
- Start date
Please read up on the joys of the french model you keep promoting as a solution to the problem of the NHS. the french goverment is also burdened by a health care deficit.
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EddieM
The NHS is variable. I had the "pleasure" of using its services lately when I sliced my foot open, tiny cut lots of blood, i hesitantly called 999 i wouldn't do that lightly, but i had three kids with me a a lot of blood pouring out. the ambulance attended promptly but couldn't stem the flow so, after the kids (correctly a priority) had been sorted i was admitted to hospital, took me 7 hours to be x-rayed and a quick dab of super glue to patch it up, what concerned me is it wasn't busy i wasn't admitted onto a ward, turns out is wasn't serious (we all know not that much blood looks a lot, about 1/2 a pint lost) but at no time was i even offered a glass of water.
I was little grumpy, but hey they sorted it. i guess, its based on clinical need do not expect to be treated like a star. could have been a lot quicker, but was effective.
I was little grumpy, but hey they sorted it. i guess, its based on clinical need do not expect to be treated like a star. could have been a lot quicker, but was effective.
Then they'd have to pay for it themselves. If they claim they can't pay, keep them in debtors' prison (another 'new' concept of mine!) until they've save up enough money (by not buying any alcohol) to pay the charges!
I would, just as I would charge anyone who sustains 'self-inflicted' injuries! If you're going to participate in potentially dangerous activities, take out some insurance.
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joinerjohn
Are you saying that anyone injured should then pay for their treatment? I'm not saying that, All I'm saying is that charging these drunken people in much the same way that RTA victims are charged. As others have pointed out, alcohol abuse at weekends, is self inflicted. RTA's are not self inflicted, but victims are charged for their treatment, so there's no argument from me about charging drunks for having their stomachs pumped.
In fact, take your question to it's logical conclusion, then what your really saying is "Everyone should be charged for any treatment." In which case it's goodbye, farewell to the NHS. (and before you ask,,, there's a whole world of difference between a sportsman injured, playing his chosen sport, and a drunk who needs his stomach pumping/emetics/treatment for the effects of alcohol.
M
mdf290
Hang on a minute lets just stop all this would you pay or the NHS should charge nonsense.
Using rough figures lets not get into an argument abut LEL and UEL etc
As it stands we pay 10% of our wages and your employers pays another 10% on top of that to run the NHS through your NI contributions.
So lets stop this bullcrap about the NHS being free.
It is in effect a government administered private health scheme.
If someone is on the average wage of say 26k then you are paying £50 per week NI and your employers tops that up with another £50
So in effect there is roughly £400 a month going into the pot for your 'free NHS healthcare'.
Personally I think people who join private health schemes should be exempt from paying a proportion of NI.
Lets be honest if I was paying £400 a month into a private health scheme I would expect them to pick me up in a Rolls Royce when it suited me and have Doctors queuing to see me.
I certainly would not expect to be kept waiting for hour and hours only to be seen by some doctor with a woeful bedside manner and even worse command of English fobbing me off because he was worried about money and targets.
The NHS is CRAP it used to lead the world but now it is CRAP.
There is a culture of arrogance of clinical staff and indifference to patients. This is not a new thing the NHS has actually been crap for years but like many things in this country everyone speaking up gets hushed and accused of some kind of ignorance and heresey.
Of course now we learn even NHS staff leaving have been paid bucketloads to keep their mouths shut.
I say we have to actually think the American way could be better and in fact if we stopped paying NI contributions and paid instead to private Health it could indeed work out individually cheaper.
Using rough figures lets not get into an argument abut LEL and UEL etc
As it stands we pay 10% of our wages and your employers pays another 10% on top of that to run the NHS through your NI contributions.
So lets stop this bullcrap about the NHS being free.
It is in effect a government administered private health scheme.
If someone is on the average wage of say 26k then you are paying £50 per week NI and your employers tops that up with another £50
So in effect there is roughly £400 a month going into the pot for your 'free NHS healthcare'.
Personally I think people who join private health schemes should be exempt from paying a proportion of NI.
Lets be honest if I was paying £400 a month into a private health scheme I would expect them to pick me up in a Rolls Royce when it suited me and have Doctors queuing to see me.
I certainly would not expect to be kept waiting for hour and hours only to be seen by some doctor with a woeful bedside manner and even worse command of English fobbing me off because he was worried about money and targets.
The NHS is CRAP it used to lead the world but now it is CRAP.
There is a culture of arrogance of clinical staff and indifference to patients. This is not a new thing the NHS has actually been crap for years but like many things in this country everyone speaking up gets hushed and accused of some kind of ignorance and heresey.
Of course now we learn even NHS staff leaving have been paid bucketloads to keep their mouths shut.
I say we have to actually think the American way could be better and in fact if we stopped paying NI contributions and paid instead to private Health it could indeed work out individually cheaper.
Err...Are you saying that anyone injured should then pay for their treatment? I'm not saying that, All I'm saying is that charging these drunken people in much the same way that RTA victims are charged. As others have pointed out, alcohol abuse at weekends, is self inflicted. RTA's are not self inflicted, but victims are charged for their treatment, so there's no argument from me about charging drunks for having their stomachs pumped.
In fact, take your question to it's logical conclusion, then what your really saying is "Everyone should be charged for any treatment." In which case it's goodbye, farewell to the NHS. (and before you ask,,, there's a whole world of difference between a sportsman injured, playing his chosen sport, and a drunk who needs his stomach pumping/emetics/treatment for the effects of alcohol.
I'm not the one advocating charging any particular group...
I'm pointing out that the 'logical conclusion' of YOUR argument is charging everyone for treatment...
FYI you get charged more tax if you join a work funded private health scheme.
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joinerjohn
Ellal, The NHS already charges anyone involved in an RTA that needs treatment, so they already discriminate against motorists and pedestrians.
So why ask me if I think a Sunday league footballer should pay for treatment of an injury sustained whilst playing??
All I have said is that the NHS should charge these drunken louts for their treatment on Friday/Saturday/whenever nights. They are an unnecessary drain , not only on the NHS, but to society in general. (but that's another argument for another thread).
As mdf has pointed out, We're all charged for the NHS anyway, through NI contributions.
So why ask me if I think a Sunday league footballer should pay for treatment of an injury sustained whilst playing??
All I have said is that the NHS should charge these drunken louts for their treatment on Friday/Saturday/whenever nights. They are an unnecessary drain , not only on the NHS, but to society in general. (but that's another argument for another thread).
As mdf has pointed out, We're all charged for the NHS anyway, through NI contributions.
E
EddieM
What about people that don't eat enough, people who participate in dangerous sports, smokers (lets not start on that one) lets genetically profile people who are more prone to cancers .......... tell you what lets not bother.
B
Big Tone
Er, okay, I'll say it...
I think there are two types of alcoholic. Those with a mental and/or emotional condition & depression - and those who are just ****ed up ****.s trying to be Jack the Lad, just because....?
I have sympathy for the former but as for the later...
Can the same be said for fatties? Well, I certainly know people who ‘comfort eat’ because of stress. Who here does not offset the stress I mentioned in a different thread with ‘something’? I used to think I had no bad habits, but looking back I was addicted, if not obsessed, with health and fitness.
Up until as recently as about five years ago I had a body fat of 7% and muscles in places I no longer have places. (And never any drugs ever). Not meant in an arrogant way but I looked good, (ostensibly), and my resting pulse rate was ~45 bpm. But I suffered injury after injury and, this is my point, I was never EVER happy in my own skin!
Bringing it forward somewhat, it was only last year, when my sister lived with me for a week while her road was being done and access to her home was urine poor, that after all her ranting about “you drink too much bruv” I found out her habits were much worse than mine!
I would come home and start cooking mixed vegetables and fish, (for example), with a glass of wine. She comes home and slobs out with a bar of chocolate and that’s her for the night!!!
So I think it's important not to be too judgemental and remember that generalisations are just that - generalisations. And it’s all too easy to be judgemental about a situation you have never personally lived or truly understand.
Tout comprendre c'est tout pardonner.
I think there are two types of alcoholic. Those with a mental and/or emotional condition & depression - and those who are just ****ed up ****.s trying to be Jack the Lad, just because....?
I have sympathy for the former but as for the later...
Can the same be said for fatties? Well, I certainly know people who ‘comfort eat’ because of stress. Who here does not offset the stress I mentioned in a different thread with ‘something’? I used to think I had no bad habits, but looking back I was addicted, if not obsessed, with health and fitness.
Up until as recently as about five years ago I had a body fat of 7% and muscles in places I no longer have places. (And never any drugs ever). Not meant in an arrogant way but I looked good, (ostensibly), and my resting pulse rate was ~45 bpm. But I suffered injury after injury and, this is my point, I was never EVER happy in my own skin!
Bringing it forward somewhat, it was only last year, when my sister lived with me for a week while her road was being done and access to her home was urine poor, that after all her ranting about “you drink too much bruv” I found out her habits were much worse than mine!
I would come home and start cooking mixed vegetables and fish, (for example), with a glass of wine. She comes home and slobs out with a bar of chocolate and that’s her for the night!!!
So I think it's important not to be too judgemental and remember that generalisations are just that - generalisations.
And it’s all too easy to be judgemental about a situation you have never personally lived or truly understand.Tout comprendre c'est tout pardonner.
Er, okay, I'll say it...
I think there are two types of alcoholic. Those with a mental and/or emotional condition & depression - and those who are just p****d up ****.s trying to be Jack the Lad, just because....?
I have sympathy for the former but as for the later...
Tout comprendre c'est tout pardonner.
You left out tos sers who get ****ed up and post bol locks on internet forums. I suppose if you just added; insecure, retarded, moron, to your 'mental, emotional, depressed' category, then you'd have them covered.
The country is broke. The NHS is a bottomless pit and given the opportunity would swallow every penny and still want more. We need another Maggie to take it on - she tried back in the '80s but got beaten back. The miners were a soft touch compared to the vested interests in the NHS.
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