Thank you for the rather extreme dumbed-down explaination of the regs and permissable departures.
My Granny is also looking for a course on how to suck eggs, maybe you could also talk to her in a condescending manner?
Perhaps you shouldn't have responded to a perfectly serious and germane point about the regulations allowing departures as long as safety is not compromised with a "i'll see your 'last sentence 120.3'
and i raise you by 'see page 4, last paragraph, 16th edition 2nd amendment (2004, brown cover)" to point out something that you knew full well was not in dispute, namely that the standard colours changed in 2004.
i know its not in dispute, may i humbly point out that it was infact you who started the disagreement, no need to use quotes or anything, just look back.
I have got absolutely no problem with considered challenges, but please put the whole thread into perspective here.
I do however, have a problem with the 'holier-than-thou-art' types who pedantically attempt to inject waaayyy too much seriousness into what seemed to be a fairly lighthearted OP.
I'm sorry - I mistakenly thought you were interested in a serious discussion - you should have made it plainer earlier on that you just wanted to play the fool.
Look again at the question in the OP, a photo with a simple question of what's the problem, i gave things like 'fuses not present' and 'front cover missing'
Just how serious did you think that was? Might i emplore you to take the original response in the spirit it was meant and not look for a point less arguement.
Like i said some time ago, if you have your ammo, based on sound judgement, then go for it!
I did. Maybe you didn't read the numbered points 1-6 in my post above.
I read your posts, did you comprehend mine?
You have a duty, that anything you do must not degrade the safety of the installation.
Indeed.
Is there any point asking you to give us a sound reason why continuing to use the colours already in use in an installation could possibly degrade its safety?
No, please read the multiple posts where i said if you have your ammo for using old stuff, go for it.
I really think you are getting way beyond reason here.
At least
I am using reason.
but not very well at all. Sounds to me like you just want to argue
In response to your question as to why i feel new installation of old colours is possibly an error of judgement is two fold.
1- It is a point of view held by some that people who are currently installing old colours are doing so to circumvent the part P requirements, making new installs look like they have been there for years, then not issuing an EIC/MWC so the date of install cannot be defined. This can be done to avoid fees payable to either a scam provider, or to BCO.
Your use of the term "scam provider" says a great deal about the sort of person you are, none of it good.
All I will say about point 1 is that I don't see why my actions should be constrained by the mistaken beliefs of people too ignorant to know what the relative dates of introduction were for harmonised cable and Part P
Aah, but your using an electrically trained mind, but i'm considering the customers perception of what MAY have happened.
2- By default, i always use new equipment, unless contracted to do otherwise. This includes cable.
You're excelling yourself at not reading what other people write, aren't you...
new (as in not previously used) cable in old colours.
Just thought i'd reciprocate!
If at some point, there was a fault, whether as a cause of a faulty cable or otherwise and this fault was examined by a 3rd party electrician, he may question the quality of the workmanship to the customer.
If he was ignorant and incapable of rational thought then I suppose he might. But then I don't see why my actions should be constrained by the possibility of people like that arriving on the scene later on.
Agreed, but that wouldn't stop the suggestion, and its at least partially about good coustomer relations, and why expose your self unnecessarily to that kind of questioning?
Imagine this scenario:-
customer -' my shower doesn't work, and the other electrician only installed it 9 months ago'
spark - ' what?? this was installed when? He must be a right cowboy, it seems as though hes used old materials,
new (as in not previously used) cable in old colours.
and probably charged you an arm or a leg!!!' That cable he used is at least 3 years old!
Blimey - is that a worryingly high age for modern PVC cables? I guess at least I don;t have to worry about the possibility of you turning up and spouting that nonsense, as you'll be far too busy going around to all of your customers from 3 years ago telling them that their cables are getting a bit flaky and it's time to replace them.
Oh Dear Oh dear, and at the end of this post you claim you're not upset. HHmm , i dont believe you
I for one, would not like to have these accusations levelled at me.
I don't suppose you would, given that you are too ignorant and unthinking to be able to defend yourself.
Tut Tut Tut, plain and simply a comment designed to insult. Do try harder if thats the way you work
This is why i called it an error of judgement and didn't quote any reg which the install is not compliant with.
You are absolutely right to think that -
you must avoid at all costs doing anything which requires
you to be capable of exercising judgement.
I excercise my judgement, and my work is compliant, and gives customer the confidence that a job job has been done using new, not obsolete materials.
Yet again, it seems as though i must re-iterate, its the perception of the customer as to what has taken place.
Theres no need to be upset, if you are happy in your reasoning, then once again, i'll re-iterate, GO FOR IT, i have no problem with it!
Oh - I can assure you I'm not upset.
