Oil Burner Safety Control (TF830.3) - red light was on .......

[Rollerball]

If the burner is encased in a tin box, it sounds like you have a balanced flue, bringing in combustion air from the outside.
By all means run the burner without it.
It is possible to test a capacitor with a multimeter but I haven’t done it so do check out YouTube?
Faulty capacitors can feel swollen or be black at the wire end, but that isn’t conclusive. Check the capacitor disconnected from the motor.
Oil pump solenoid coils do fail, look for an open circuit immediately the burner locks out......Diamond replacements are best.
The EBi is the igniter transformer, failure is possible and I have found that they can take out the Tf too!
Did you find the allen grub screws I was blethering about?
John

I do find that without the tin box it's a bit more smelly (as in a slightly sooty smell) but I'll see how it goes without it. Why don't they make it easier to remove (with no chance of knuckle-scraping and less effort involved?).

Noted re the capacitor. Think I'll skip that though, looks tricky to get out and I don't want to make the boiler worse. This particular cap LOOKS okay.

Where am I looking for an open circuit if the burner locks out? Do you have any details please or can maybe point me to a suitable online guide?

Is the EBi easy to test in circuit or does it need to be removed?

Yes, I can see the Allen grub screws.



Thanks

 

[Rollerball]

It could also be the BFP coil Or the EB1 failing intermittently,

Any easy way to test those?

 

[Terrywookfit]

No easy way unless you are present when it locks out..

EB1 will be no spark during light up .

Coil will be an attempted re ignition during a burn and an d an o/c coil which will return to a few K after cooling.

If the motor does not run on heat demand then misalignment of the pump ( 3 screws,) Capacitor, and a tight spot on the oil pump gears are all possibilities.

 

[Rollerball]

No easy way unless you are present when it locks out..

EB1 will be no spark during light up .

Coil will be an attempted re ignition during a burn and an d an o/c coil which will return to a few K after cooling.

If the motor does not run on heat demand then misalignment of the pump ( 3 screws,) Capacitor, and a tight spot on the oil pump gears are all possibilities.

Thanks, sounds like it'll be potentially tricky to repair if not in lockout , random faults can be a pain.

 

[Rollerball]

Update on this:

Boiler service guy hasn't yet been able to come out, now due later in the week.

In the meantime the lockouts are becoming more regular - bearing in mind the boiler only fires up twice a day, sometimes it will go into lockout both times, other times only once.

I'm also noticing that while it used to be the case that I only needed to press the lockout button once on the TF830.3 controller, I'm now sometimes needing to press it two or three times. I do notice that there's a tiny spark inside the controller when it activates the burner successfully, however during the time where I've pressed the button and it's done nothing I've not seen that tiny spark - does this indicate that the controller is at fault?

Finally, I've been looking at Honeywell's/Satronic's info sheet on the controller, it can be found here:

https://www.satronic.co.uk/download/TF%20830.3,832.3%20(EN).pdf

In the 'Important Notes' section it states:

"For safety reasons a minimum of one control shut-down
per 24 hours has to be observed."

Am I correct in taking this to mean that if the controller locks out more than once in 24 hours the boiler is a safety hazard? If so, and bearing in mind I'm now sometimes getting two lockouts per day, should I stop using the boiler?

Secondly, I'm tempted to buy a new controller and install it myself - it looks very easy as there's one screw and it just plugs in. However, the above PDF also states:

"The controls must be installed by qualified personnel
only. The relevant national regulations have to be
observed."

Is this just them covering their backs or is it safe for me to replace the controller myself? I am quite skilled technically but I'm of course not an oil boiler repair person.

Or isn't it quite as simple as "turn off the boiler at the mains, replace controller and switch boiler back on at the mains"? Is there more to it than that?

 

[Burnerman]

It could be an idea to replace the Tf - at least you’ll have a spare and they aren’t expensive.
There is a time interval after lockout for the Tf to reset.....I can’t comment about the spark!
Only one screw secures these, you can’t go wrong with that.
Oil boilers dont like frequent lockouts, the oil pump relies on kero circulating to keep it lubricated.
John

 

[Rollerball]

Thanks John.

So am I breaking any boiler safety rules if I replace the TF830 myself?

Also, regarding disconnecting the boiler from the mains first - does this mean simply ensuring that the boiler isn't active via the timer? If not then on the wall near the boiler there's a plain white box with a few white mains leads coming out of it - one goes to a pump on a nearby water pipe, one to the back of the boiler and the other to a mains plug which I could turn off if required.

Assuming the latter, do I just switch off at the mains, replace the TF830 and switch back on again? Is that it? Nothing else to do?

 

[Burnerman]

Yes, just turn the boiler off anywhere that is convenient then pop the new Tf in and switch back on. Nothing to be worried about!
You may find you need to press the lockout afterwards to get it going.
Good luck with it!
John

 

[Rollerball]

Thanks again John - as long as I'm not breaking any oil burner maintenance rules and I'm doing the controller replacement correctly then that's fine with me.

 

[Rollerball]

One other observation about the boiler - during the past couple of days I've noticed that sometimes prior to ignition the motor sounds a little noisier and during those times when ignition does take place there a louder 'whoomf". The latter is kind of like letting the gas build up for too long on the hob before igniting it, so I guess that what is sometimes happening with the boiler is that more kerosene is building up before it finally ignites? This is though only occasional.

 

[Rollerball]

You may find you need to press the lockout afterwards to get it going.

You're right there! Just fitted the replacement controller and it went into lockout - took a dozen or so button presses before it eventually let the boiler fire up (the old controller usually took 3 or 4 max). Will monitor it and see if the lockout still occurs, if it does I at least have a spare controller.

 

[Burnerman]

Unusual combustion noises on start up are often due to the electrode position, I’ve found......once set correctly they hardly ever change.
There’s plenty of info available on these, but generally the gap is around 2.5mm and the spark occurs just behind the nozzle - the spark being blown into the flame by the fan.
A faulty nozzle can also give a poor oil spray, of course!
Guesswork all the way, I’m afraid.
John

 

[Rollerball]

Thanks - seems to be a process of elimination. Well, if this new controller goes into lockout hopefully the repair guy can get to the root cause.

 

[Rollerball]

Latest update to this - my plumber (also a certified boiler engineer) paid a visit but of course the boiler wouldn't lockout for him.

So as the fault is so random we seem to be down to the stage that is 'replace assorted parts and see if that fixes the issue' - and that of course could work out very expensive. I'm hanging fire on that for now.

Bearing in mind this is a Worcester Danesmoor (model: 15/19) he didn mention that he thought Worcester offered a service where one of their own engineers replaces all suspect parts for a fixed fee, something like £300. Has anyone heard of this service?

I'll give Worcester a call on Monday and see what they have to say.

 

[Johntheo5]

Unusual combustion noises on start up are often due to the electrode position, I’ve found......once set correctly they hardly ever change.
There’s plenty of info available on these, but generally the gap is around 2.5mm and the spark occurs just behind the nozzle - the spark being blown into the flame by the fan.
A faulty nozzle can also give a poor oil spray, of course!
Guesswork all the way, I’m afraid.
John

Surprising the engineer didn't check the pump pressure at least.

These are the settings for my 18 year old Firebird 90s fitted with a Riello G5X burner jetted for 20kw output, I've never had to adjust the electrode gap, it has stayed at exactly 4.2MM. I just remove the flame tube and give the electrodes a wipe down every year.