Picture quiz

[flameport]

A lot less than 3m, which is why it doesn't comply.

That doesn't make it immediately dangerous though.

 

[Spark123]

701 refers to a location containing a bathtub or shower basin.
If there is no shower basin then section 701 doesn't apply which is why I asked "Where is the shower basin?"

 

[securespark]

701 refers to a location containing a bathtub or shower basin.
If there is no shower basin then section 701 doesn't apply which is why I asked "Where is the shower basin?"

My regs chapter 701 is titled "locations containing a bath or shower". No mention of basin in the title. It goes on to make provision for showers without a basin.

See also Fig 701.1 e). Shower, without basin.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

701 is titled "Locations containing a bath or shower", nothing about a basin.

701.32.2, 701.32.3, 701.32.4 and Figure 701.1 all make explicit mention of showers without basins.

[EDIT]Doh![/EDIT]

 

[Spark123]

Aye - I'll stand corrected - must have been thinking about the 16th edn terminology.
I'm still debating though if the shower head isn't being used for the purpose of showering if section 701 applies.

 

[securespark]

Following the diagram I mentioned, Zones 0 & 1 in this case follow an arc 1.2m from the centre of the fixed water outlet.

There is no Z2.


Socket outlets are prohibited within 3m horizontally from boundary of Z1.

So the s/o is still unacceptable, surely?

 

[Spark123]

I'm still pondering though - what is the chance of someone showering in there?
Just the fact there is a shower head doesn't necesserally mean someone is going to use the place as a shower - I can connect a shower head to my kitchen taps and use it to clean the pots with but doesn't make it a special location.
I certainly wouldn't shower in the kitchen sink! (No images svp )

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Following the diagram I mentioned, Zones 0 & 1 in this case follow an arc 1.2m from the centre of the fixed water outlet.

Which seems utterly ridiculous - in a wet room with no partitions and no basin, surely the only logical way to define the zones is with reference to the arc described by the shower head?

It makes no sense that the regulations simply don't recognise the existence of showers with demountable water outlets.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I'm still pondering though - what is the chance of someone showering in there?
Just the fact there is a shower head doesn't necesserally mean someone is going to use the place as a shower

Irrelevant - if the room contains a shower it contains a shower.

I certainly wouldn't shower in the kitchen sink!

I should hope not, particularly if you p*** in the shower...

 

[securespark]

It makes no sense that the regulations simply don't recognise the existence of showers with demountable water outlets.

I kind of agree with you. HOWEVER, where do you draw the line? It all depends on how long your hose is (no puns please!).

My shower has a 2m hose. I could hose down the pullcord for the light if I wanted to, which is well outside the zones...

Does that make the whole room Z1? If so, you'd have difficulty fitting certain electrical equipment in and make it comply.

 

[VanSolo]

This is the debate I had on site and the reason why I posted on here,to get a few different opinions on it. I know it is unlikely that anyone will be showering in the room but there is no getting away from the fact that it is a wetroom with a hairdressing sink in it. Threfore no socket outlets.

 

[RF Lighting]

But you are allowed sockets in a hairdressers shop. Where else would they plug in the clippers / curling tongs?

Also what about those long hoses for pot washing in commercial kitchens?

Does these become a room containing a shower, and require cross bonding if all of the circuits are not RCD protected etc?

<edited to include a smaller photo>

 

[ban-all-sheds]

But you are allowed sockets in a hairdressers shop. Where else would they plug in the clippers / curling tongs?

They don't have showers.

A showerhead on a hose from a basin tap is not a shower.

As observed above, it's the capability which matters. The room in the picture might be intended for, and actually used for, any number of non-showering activities, but it does contain a shower.

If you checked into a hotel and asked for a room with a shower, and they gave you one with a hairdresser-type basin, would you agree that they had met your requirement?

Also what about those long hoses for pot washing in commercial kitchens?

They aren't showers.

Does these become a room containing a shower

If you opened the door off your hotel bedroom and found that, would you agree that the hotel had provided you with a bathroom with shower?

Or if you were having property renovated at a distance, and as part of that had asked for a shower to be installed, but had left it to them to choose what, and found they'd done that, would you say "that's fine, here's your money"?

It's not a shower.

 

[RF Lighting]

But whats the difference between the ones in my examples, and the one in the OP's picture?

From what I can see, the only way to use that 'shower' without causing some sort of flood, which would require mopping up, would be to direct the water flow into the basin.

So, IMO, even though the bit that squirts water is sold as a shower, when installed it this situation, it can't be used by someone to take a shower, and therefore it is no more a shower than the flexible pot washer in my picture above is.

 

[ericmark]

It seems my first reply was close to the mark. This is not the first time I have come across this problem. When is a shower not a shower.

From the picture one can't tell but I will repeat what I said before.

If anyone is likely to use the room with bare feet and use the device as a shower then socket needs removing.

If however it is unlikely that anyone will use the room with bare feet then I would consider it the same way as any other hose pipe and the socket is OK so long as of course RCD protected.

I agree it is hard to draw the line and this could go on for weeks but that is my personal opinion and is how I would deal with the problem.