Price hike during installation

[Martin Daler]

I'm having double glazing installed by a reputable local firm with 30 years' trading. Everything is in the quote, including the installation of required extenal lintels. Their surveyor had full access and I pointed out the state of the external brickwork where the lintels are required - there are staircase cracks in the pointing above both the downstairs openings and no compression on the bricks. Even had I not done so, it's clearly visible, no rendering etc.

Anyway, having completed upstairs, as soon as they started downstairs the window installers (employees of the double glazing co, not subbed out) declared that the lintel installation was beyond their capability and would require a "master builder", for fear of bringing the house down. They came equipped with Acrow props anyway, so they were expecting to have to prop things up. Moreover, the installers can not have seen anything that was not previously visible to the surveyor.

Now the company is intimating there will be extra charges as they had not costed for the services of a builder to install the lintels. To be clear, both lintels are included in the job spec on the contract, and there is no clause about variation in price.

Where do I stand?

 

[Notch7]

I think this is the job where you wernt happy with one of the window dimensions.

They have moved the goalposts in order to recoup the extra costs of a replacement window etc.

In other words trying it on.

Have you paid them any deposit money?

 

[Martin Daler]

Yes, same job. No, I have paid zero so far. Their manager will come and see the windows - he said if it's a mis-measure fair enough and they can replace. As to brickwork he is saying that according to the builder things are pretty bad and will need propping through the wall rather than just propping the external skin. No mention this time of extra cost.
Hopefully they will decide that their reputation is worth more than the profit on this job and face up to their contractual obligations.
My query here was really about whether they have the right to lay the extra costs on me. I don't doubt that that extra cost will accrue, but I see that as their business risk, not mine.

 

[Notch7]

My query here was really about whether they have the right to lay the extra costs on me. I don't doubt that that extra cost will accrue, but I see that as their business risk, not mine

It depends what was quoted.

The job shouldve been priced 'subject to survey'. Then the surveyor should have raised his concern..

It sounds like nobody surveyed the job properly and now its more work than they thought, rather than my assumption they were trying to claw back a remake cost.


With building works its difficult to quote for things that are unseen and dont present themselves until work exposes the problem.

A trademen shouldnt have to absorb any business risk. Anything he cant see, he should make sure there is provision in his terms to charge more.

If lintels have been included, it should say what that work includes and the terms should indicate if there may be unknowns

If the quote isnt clear, you have to decide whether there is extra cost in the work that couldnt be anticipated and if so whether you dont want to pay that because of a weak contract.

 

[Martin Daler]

But nothing was unseen before which is now seen. Nothing new has been exposed. Nothing is knowable now that was not knowable before. The company's surveyor saw the same wall that the company's fitters see now. Same presentation exactly. I might have been sympathetic had the wall been covered in render and the problem only came to light when it was chipped away, for example. But none of it - the fitters just made a different judgement than the surveyor.
I can see why the surveyor might think life is easy, if he can simply charge the client more to cover oversights omissions and errors, whilst getting paid more than the fitters who uncover his mistakes.
And I'm not talking about a tradesman shouldering the risk individually, I'm talking about the company - this is all one company.

 

[FiremanT]

On the face of it, they are trying it on. But the critically lies within the T&C’s.
Have a very good read before saying too much or you may talk yourself into liability.

Can you read and understand Legalese?

 

[blup]

You have a contract with the company to install lintels, the lack of confidence/experience of their installers is not a reason for the company to breach that contract.

So you may have a case if you decide to get someone else in to finish/rectify the work.

But I am not a builder or a judge.

Blup

 

[catlad]

Did the surveyor measure the windows as well?

 

[Martin Daler]

Yes, the surveyor took all measurements and assessed all aspects of the job. The sales manager had already specced the job in terms of numbers of windows, approx sizes, finishes, etc. It was made clear that nothing was contractual until the surveyor had done his bit. I believe he owns the firm.

 

[catlad]

So he can't survey and he can't use a tape measure
Not a good sign.

 

[FiremanT]

Yes, the surveyor took all measurements and assessed all aspects of the job. The sales manager had already specced the job in terms of numbers of windows, approx sizes, finishes, etc. It was made clear that nothing was contractual until the surveyor had done his bit. I believe he owns the firm.

Have you read the general T&C's?

 

[Notch7]

But nothing was unseen before which is now seen. Nothing new has been exposed. Nothing is knowable now that was not knowable before. The company's surveyor saw the same wall that the company's fitters see now. Same presentation exactly. I might have been sympathetic had the wall been covered in render and the problem only came to light when it was chipped away, for example. But none of it - the fitters just made a different judgement than the surveyor.

Not uncommon TBH -I would trust the fitters more than the surveyor.

as you say nothing more has been exposed, the extra work should have been costed in the original quote.

The company should just hold their hands up and admit they were wrong -the fact they are starting to install and havent asked for money shows they must be reputable, so they should just admit their mistake and sort it out.

 

[securespark]

Where do I stand?

Did they give you an estimate or a quote?