Progress on Brexit talks

[transam]

Actually, the largest minority of electors, elected suffcient politicians to form a govenment.

Now if this was Wannabe replying, it would have gone along the lines of "You really don't know anything about politics do you, you're obviously useless and worthless, and being so stupid, I'm amazed they even let you vote. Minorities don't elect politicians, people vote for their party, and the party with the greatest number of politicians then forms a government."

yep that is what he would have said probably accuse some one of being a porkie pier

A Tibetan yak herders Yak has got more intelligence then way har bee

 

[Corgigrouch GTi]

are you under the impression somebody has done that?

Has the EU produced a bill for our inspection? If so can this tax payer see?

 

[Doggit]

David Davis said they (the lawyers I think) were going through it line by line, so ones been presented, but I don't think it's for public perusal yet. But for most people, this would just be a high opening bid, that they knew would get knocked down, so why is Bernier getting so annoyed that we are querying it. On his attitude to date, I wouldn't be at all surprised if they haven't taken in to account the payments we would be making over the same period as the bill covers.

 

[Corgigrouch GTi]

I wonder if we will counter claim for the UKs share of the assets in the EU?

 

[JohnD]

David Davis said they (the lawyers I think) were going through it line by line, so ones been presented

I'm not sure "a bill" "has been presented". It appears that the EU has put forward some points.

"Over a three-hour Powerpoint presentation, British officials picked apart the EU claims over liabilities, which are reputed to be about €75bn, although Barnier has never cited a figure.

Numbers were not on the table during the latest talks. Instead the two sides are trying to hammer out liabilities the UK could face – a politically sensitive task that will shed light on the final bill and is bound to incite charges of betrayal from hardline Brexiters.

David Davis, the Brexit secretary, has acknowledged the UK has “obligations” from its 44 years of EU membership, but is refusing to say what they are."

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...otiators-their-brexit-bill-sums-do-not-add-up

What was it that Buffoon Boris said?

 

[Doggit]

DD might well, but I can't see the likes of Liam Fox having the balls to. Having said that, apart from the hedquarters at Brussels and Luxembourg, I expect they've spent the rest.

Numbers were not on the table during the latest talks

But that doesn't make sense, as the following paragraphs from the Guardian article suggest that figures are being discusses. And who in their right mind would knock up a Power Point demonstration to discuss liabilities.

The UK has told EU negotiators their sums on the Brexit bill do not add up, as talks on Britain’s separation from the bloc hit deadlock.

Tensions boiled over in Brussels as the EU accused Britain of failing to reveal its hand on the financial settlement. UK officials hit back at the EU, saying some claims for money had no legal basis.

And the Bernier goes on to say

“To be flexible you need two points – our point and their point,” Barnier told reporters. “We need to know their position and then I can be flexible.”

So he's effectively trying to say that Britan should go to the meeting with a letter stating what it's going to pay, and he'll go with his list, but he's not prepared to have a third party negotiating a mid point, he want to do that himself. Can anyone tell me, is this guy for real. I know he was picked by the EU for his tough stance, but it almost looks that they want the talks to fail yt choosing such a unbending negotiator.

 

[JohnD]

But that doesn't make sense, as the following paragraphs from the Guardian article suggest that figures are being discusses. And who in their right mind would knock up a Power Point demonstration to discuss liabilities.

The UK has told EU negotiators their sums on the Brexit bill do not add up, as talks on Britain’s separation from the bloc hit deadlock

You mean, if we believe that the Guardian's headline has correctly reported "the UK" (does that mean david davis?

and if we believe that davis is speaking accurately

then it could only be true if some numbers had been put forward?

Is it true, then? Or not? Where is davis' official statement?

Can you find someone saying that figures have been proposed?

The guardian also says "the UK has not published a paper on the Brexit financial settlement" in which case we don't know what the UK thinks the approach should be.

" The most important document on the financial side of Brexit is the “position paper” of 12 June 2017. This should be read carefully. The annexes are especially important — here the EU has set out the heads of what will be affected by departure. There are no figures. There is, however, reference to methodologies and principles. The EU is saying, in essence, agree what needs to be covered and they will be covered, and whatever figure comes out at the end, will be the amount to pay."

https://www.ft.com/content/7d26e4e9-2eb0-3afb-94ec-5874e178c311

 

[Doggit]

Now do you pay a subscription to the FT John, or do you know a way of getting round their pay to look further page.

You mean, if we believe that the Guardian's headline has correctly reported "the UK" (does that mean david davis?

But it's the Guardian John, it's one of you're bibles; swhy are you doubting it.

The most important document on the financial side of Brexit is the “position paper” of 12 June 2017

That's months ago. Surely they'd have put some figures down on paper by now.

 

[Corgigrouch GTi]

You mean, if we believe that the Guardian's headline has correctly reported "the UK" (does that mean david davis?

and if we believe that davis is speaking accurately

then it could only be true if some numbers had been put forward?

Is it true, then? Or not? Where is davis' official statement?

Can you find someone saying that figures have been proposed?

The guardian also says "the UK has not published a paper on the Brexit financial settlement" in which case we don't know what the UK thinks the approach should be.

" The most important document on the financial side of Brexit is the “position paper” of 12 June 2017. This should be read carefully. The annexes are especially important — here the EU has set out the heads of what will be affected by departure. There are no figures. There is, however, reference to methodologies and principles. The EU is saying, in essence, agree what needs to be covered and they will be covered, and whatever figure comes out at the end, will be the amount to pay."

https://www.ft.com/content/7d26e4e9-2eb0-3afb-94ec-5874e178c311

In other words, once we agree what we will pay for, then the EU will apply their figure to it.... We could well end up being presented with a bill of £100 billion for a slightly used paperclip....

If the EU want to be taken seriously, then surly they should persent us with a list of our liabilities (As they see it) with a figure for each liability.. Then we discuss what we see is reasonable to pay... To go back to our restaurant, the menu has no prices on and the waiter decided how much to charge once the meal is consumed..

 

[Doggit]

If the EU want to be taken seriously,

And therein lies the problem; they are so far up their rear ends, that they can't see how stupid they are carrying on.

 

[JohnD]

But it's the Guardian John, it's one of you're bibles

don't be silly.

Show us one of your own references if you don't like that one.

If you think some figures have been proposed by one of the two parties in the negotiations, show us what they are.

 

[JohnD]

Even the Buffoon has changed his mind (so quickly!)

"Boris Johnson concedes UK will have to pay for Brexit
Foreign secretary says UK will meet legal obligations to pay divorce bill to EU, having previously said it could ‘go whistle’

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...hnson-concedes-uk-will-have-to-pay-for-brexit

 

[Doggit]

Um, you've obviously missed the point of this thread John, we don't know if there are any figures, and we're speculating on what the hell both sides are up to.

Oh, and I'm not being silly. The Guardians left wing, the FTs left wing, and you're very left wing. The day you post an article from the Mail or the Telegraph as a political stance you support, then I'll see a more reasonable side of you. But I'm not expecting an exothermic reaction in Hell any time soon.

"Boris Johnson concedes UK will have to pay for Brexit

Uh Yeah, so. But playing the same game that you tend to, kindly point out where he said he'd have to pay for Brexit.

 

[Corgigrouch GTi]

Even the Buffoon has changed his mind (so quickly!)

"Boris Johnson concedes UK will have to pay for Brexit
Foreign secretary says UK will meet legal obligations to pay divorce bill to EU, having previously said it could ‘go whistle’

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...hnson-concedes-uk-will-have-to-pay-for-brexit

I suspect that there is a huge difference between genuine legal obligations and the ammount that the EU demand... Who determines what a legal obligation is, where in the many EU treaties and agreements is it written what must be paid when a country leaves the EU?

 

[Doggit]

It seems that when the guy wrote article 50, he didn't envisage it being used, so didn't bother to make it water tight, hence why they're arguing over the terms. As the EU refuse to allow an independant negotiator to settle the dispute, and are insisting that no exit deal can be negotiated until the divorce bill is agreed (on their terms only I suspect) then this is going to drag on, and get very acrimonious.