RCBO Type B Manufacturers - Any Difference?

[jonwestuk]

Hi all,

Quick query. My electrician has advised me to buy all of the RCBOs prior to his arrival next week. I have a good cheap supplier of such things but am wondering if there is much difference between the different manufacturers of RBCOs?

The prices vary quite a bit (60% from top to bottom), yet I would have thought that the function of such devices would be very highly regulated. Can you let me know if there are any major concerns with certain manufacturers? Are there any significant advantages of premium manufacturers vs the cheaper alternatives?

The manufacturers I can choose from are:
Contactum
MK
Hager
Sentry
Wylex
Crabtree

Thanks for your help,

Jon

 

[AndyPRK]

You should by the same brand as the consumer unit so it will fit correctly !

What brand CU are you having ?

 

[ricicle]

What sort of cheapskate electrician are you employing?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

The devices you purchase should be type tested to the board you are fitting them to, do not mix and match.
And to answer your question, manufacturers devices are very often of a different profile and are not a generic fit to all boards.
Have you researched your electricians credentials? As it seems a bit odd that they have asked you to source RCBOs of any brand. You would require the board first then you select the devices according/compliant to that board and the circuits of the installation.

 

[GaryGarden]

Hi all,

I have a good cheap supplier of such things but am wondering if there is much difference between the different manufacturers of RBCOs?

Your "cheap supplier" would worry me more than the manufacturers brand, go to somewhere big like B&Q or one of the wholesalers or you risk imported fakes with no leakage or overcurrent protection.
And make sure that your spark tests them.

 

[ericmark]

A consumer unit is a type tested distribution unit and to maintain the type testing you have to use same make of RCBO as consumer unit.

There are fakes where the device is only a switch with no real protection but disregarding them yes there are different qualities of RCD.

With Hager and Contactum there are double pole and single pole switching not sure about other makes. With a TT system needs to be double pole with a TN system double pole does make fault finding easier but not essential.

Some RCBO's need a earth wire connecting others don't and I have never really worked out why it is required with some types.

As to RCBO not sure but basic RCD versions like X-Pole trip 90 - 100% of rating where others trip at 50 - 100% of rating. Electronic units do seem to resist nuance tripping better than non electronic.

Most electricians have their favourites if they have used X manufacture and had problems they steer clear of that make but it's not just you get what you pay for even expensive ones can cause problems.

Getting customer to buy is a easy get out. Any faults and electrician can wash their hands. There is a huge difference to supply and fit to fit customers parts what ever the trade.

With supply and fit retail price is charged and should an item prove faulty the trader has to not only absorb the cost of the faulty item but also the cost to replace. This is why they charge retail for item fitted. However where customer supplies should the item prove faulty then the trader can charge the customer to replace the item. It does not matter if electrical or car parts rules are the same.

So if you supply parts you also take the risk should part prove faulty.

The problem arises where it is unclear if product or workmanship is faulty.

As an electrician there is also a problem. Buy parts and customer defaults and you are very much out of pocket. One losing payment for labour is less of a problem.

 

[JohnW2]

With Hager and Contactum there are double pole and single pole switching not sure about other makes. With a TT system needs to be double pole with a TN system double pole does make fault finding easier but not essential.

I am not aware of any requirement for protective devices to be double-pole in a TT installation. The regs do require a means of isolation, which has to be double-pole in the case of TT, but a Main Switch (and/or DP RCD, when MCBs are used) will satisfy that requirement.

Have you ever seen a TT installation in which the CU was full of DP MCBs (plus an RCD) or DP RCBOs?

Goodness only knows what DP RCBOs cost - and I presume most are 2-module ones, so one would need a pretty big CU

Kind Regards, John

 

[Robin0577]

Goodness only knows what DP RCBOs cost

Kind Regards, John

A decent one from a manufacturer like Eaton or Schneider for a common rating like 32A/30mA is going to set you back about £80-90 bought individually. I use quite a few for building mobile distribution boxes for theatre work.

 

[JohnW2]

Goodness only knows what DP RCBOs cost

A decent one from a manufacturer like Eaton or Schneider for a common rating like 32A/30mA is going to set you back about £80-90 bought individually. I use quite a few for building mobile distribution boxes for theatre work.

That's not far off my guess - a large CU full of them would definitely not be cheap!

You may, reasonably, use them for the purpose you describe, but have you ever seen them in a domestic TT installation?

Kind Regards, John

 

[Robin0577]

No, I haven't but then I've not done any significant domestic work since Part P came in, at least not that I'm going to admit to here.

 

[JohnW2]

No, I haven't but then I've not done any significant domestic work since Part P came in, at least not that I'm going to admit to here.

Fair enough. I'm sure that my experience/exposure is lot less than even yours, but I nevertheless strongly suspect that one would have to look very hard to find any DP RCBOs (or DP MCBs, come to that) in 'normal' domestic installations!

Kind Regards, John

 

[jonwestuk]

A consumer unit is a type tested distribution unit and to maintain the type testing you have to use same make of RCBO as consumer unit.

There are fakes where the device is only a switch with no real protection but disregarding them yes there are different qualities of RCD.

With Hager and Contactum there are double pole and single pole switching not sure about other makes. With a TT system needs to be double pole with a TN system double pole does make fault finding easier but not essential.

Some RCBO's need a earth wire connecting others don't and I have never really worked out why it is required with some types.

As to RCBO not sure but basic RCD versions like X-Pole trip 90 - 100% of rating where others trip at 50 - 100% of rating. Electronic units do seem to resist nuance tripping better than non electronic.

Most electricians have their favourites if they have used X manufacture and had problems they steer clear of that make but it's not just you get what you pay for even expensive ones can cause problems.

Getting customer to buy is a easy get out. Any faults and electrician can wash their hands. There is a huge difference to supply and fit to fit customers parts what ever the trade.

With supply and fit retail price is charged and should an item prove faulty the trader has to not only absorb the cost of the faulty item but also the cost to replace. This is why they charge retail for item fitted. However where customer supplies should the item prove faulty then the trader can charge the customer to replace the item. It does not matter if electrical or car parts rules are the same.

So if you supply parts you also take the risk should part prove faulty.

The problem arises where it is unclear if product or workmanship is faulty.

As an electrician there is also a problem. Buy parts and customer defaults and you are very much out of pocket. One losing payment for labour is less of a problem.

This is really useful and interesting information and I am genuinely very appreciative of the post.

The guy I am using for this work is very good and I speak as someone who is a very competent DIYer. He has been very kind to support me as I undertake most of the labour myself, coming in on a regular basis to validate what I am doing and discuss the plans.

In terms of the supplier. I was not sure whether or not we can post names of suppliers but it seems from some of the posts that it is okay. I am using TLC Direct, who are no fly by night trader and I trust, as much as anyone can, that all their parts are genuine.

The reason for my electrician asking me to get the parts is as this is what I have done all the way through and to be fair when he has found parts for me TLC has always been cheaper so he is assuming that I will do the same here.

I understand the risk that I take purchasing the parts myself, but to be fair I believe that the the price I am getting for his labour is reflective of this.

Thank you all for the info you have provided. Thanks to your comments I now know that my consumer unit is a Wylex and I will be purchasing the corresponding RCBOs.

 

[flameport]

What sort of cheapskate electrician are you employing?

One who gets the customer to buy all the parts so they can avoid registering for VAT.

 

[AndyPRK]

I hope you have agreed the ratings amps of the rcbos to purchase.

 

[RF Lighting]

What sort of cheapskate electrician are you employing?

One who gets the customer to buy all the parts so they can avoid registering for VAT.

I do exactly that quite a bit with some of my customers, also if we are for example rewiring a house where it is likely the materials will be stolen before the job is completed, we insist the customer takes the risk.