Relocation of new main supply outside with white cabinet

[JBR]

I'm very grateful for the interest.
I can understand the objection to there being a switch/isolator (or whatever the correct term is) between the DNO's main fuse (or whatever the correct term is!) and the meter, due to the possibility of stealing electricity.
For that reason, I'd be happy to have the meter moved to the outdoor cabinet and a switch/isolator fitted between that and the CU. I am assuming that in order to read the meter the provider (Sainsbury's Energy) would have an appropriate key to open a locked cabinet.
The possible problem, if I understand things correctly, would be the long distance between this switch/isolator and the CU, which would remain inside the house about 30 feet away. Would this require further DNO fuses where the cables (I was informed they would be SWA) emerge just before the CU? Again, that wouldn't be a problem for me.

I'm conscious that I seem to have taken over this thread from the OP, and for that I'd like to apologise. If the mods would prefer to move my 'contributions' to my original thread:
//www.diynot.com/diy/threads/illegal-cabling-and-strange-box.430930/page-6#3385607
I'd be quite happy.

 

[JBR]

I further imagine that the 'rule' only really serves to reduce the hassle for them in (very rarely) having to attend to replace a blown cut-out fuse

Just as a matter of interest, the existing cut-out fuses (if what you refer to is what I'm thinking of) are in an ancient cast iron box under the bedroom floor (it's a bungalow) where the supply enters the house. Until recently, and for at least the past ten years that we have been here, this was sited underneath a fitted wardrobe, so if the fuses had blown we'd have been a bit stuck!

 

[EFLImpudence]

For that reason, I'd be happy to have the meter moved to the outdoor cabinet

I cannot imagine they would do otherwise.

I am assuming that in order to read the meter the provider (Sainsbury's Energy) would have an appropriate key to open a locked cabinet.

It's only a triangular fitting.

Would this require further DNO fuses where the cables (I was informed they would be SWA) emerge just before the CU?

No

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Hmmm - not sure about "No". Not as in "it's wrong" - it is the right answer to JBR's question about a fuse at the CU end of the SWA, but overall there is more to consider.

If SWA is acceptable to the DNO, then no fuse is needed at the origin of that. But if it's not, then the "switch/isolator" should be a switchfuse.

Also....

For that reason, I'd be happy to have the meter moved to the outdoor cabinet.

If that were done, how long would the cables from the supply fuse to the new meter position be?

 

[JBR]

For that reason, I'd be happy to have the meter moved to the outdoor cabinet.

If that were done, how long would the cables from the supply fuse to the new meter position be?

A few inches! I'm assuming that they'd put the meter in the outdoor box next to the supply fuse. The isolator switch, if they agree to include one, would come after the meter and in the same box.

As I understand it, the cables would then run (as they do at present, but in an iron conduit) for about 30 feet under the floor to the consumer unit in a cupboard. The DNO told me that they would likely be armoured.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I must be missing something.

If you have the meter moved and it becomes 30' from there to A, why won't it also be 30' from B?

 

[JohnW2]

I must be missing something. ... If you have the meter moved and it becomes 30' from there to A, why won't it also be 30' from B?

I thought we were now talking about having B, as well as the meter, moved 30' away from A (i.e. both moved into an external cabinet)? If so, the meter and B would then be very close to one another (as the OP has said, "inches"), the pair of them being ~30' from A (the CU) - i.e. the usual 'long tails' situation.

Kind Regards, John

Kind Regards, John

 

[westie101]

As it is their requirement, I do not see why the DNO should object to the switchfuse in their cabinet nor do I see why SWA would make a difference.

As the system develops, mainly as the gas supply reduces in the future, there is no knowing what additional equipment the DNOs/Suppliers will need. If space in the cabinets is taken by customers equipment it will lead to immediate problems.
That requirement has been in place and accepted since the cabinets were introduced in the late 1960s/early 1970s.

As for why the DNO requires a customer fuse.

Well it it operates late evening, that's the customer in darkness till morning, own fuse can be replaced

(Cynical one) If owing to a failure a fire starts, no fuse the DNO could be liable. Customer fuse customer problem.

Why should the DNOs provide electrical protection for excessive amounts of the customer's property. Where would it stop? The decision is 3m

As with equipment in cabinet requirement goes back 40+ years and is classed as a condition of supply.

 

[JohnW2]

Well it it operates late evening, that's the customer in darkness till morning, own fuse can be replaced ... (Cynical one) If owing to a failure a fire starts, no fuse the DNO could be liable. Customer fuse customer problem. ... Why should the DNOs provide electrical protection for excessive amounts of the customer's property. Where would it stop? The decision is 3m.

What about the question that a couple of us have asked. If the connection from meter to CU (or whatever) is in, say, steel conduit and/or SWA (not literally from meter, but from very close to it), does the requirement for a customer fuse when the distance is >3m still apply?

Kind Regards, John

 

[westie101]

What about the question that a couple of us have asked. If the connection from meter to CU (or whatever) is in, say, steel conduit and/or SWA (not literally from meter, but from very close to it), does the requirement for a customer fuse when the distance is >3m still apply?

Yes it does, it's the customers property so the customer is responsible for it's electrical protection

 

[JohnW2]

What about the question that a couple of us have asked. If the connection from meter to CU (or whatever) is in, say, steel conduit and/or SWA (not literally from meter, but from very close to it), does the requirement for a customer fuse when the distance is >3m still apply?

Yes it does, it's the customers property so the customer is responsible for it's electrical protection

Yes I realise that, but do I take it that you are saying that mechanical protection and/or SWA is not considered to be adequate 'electrical protection'?

Do you use 'special' fuses in your cutouts? If not, how much discrimination would you expect to see between, say, an 80A fuse in a customer's switch-fuse and an 80A or 60A cutout fuse?

Kind Regards, John

 

[JBR]

I must be missing something.

If you have the meter moved and it becomes 30' from there to A, why won't it also be 30' from B?

I was assuming that they would move B, along with the meter, to the outdoor box.
I'm not sure whether I have caused confusion due to my lack of knowledge of terminology.
Can I assume that B, then, is the DNO's fuse? It looks a bit small compared to the existing cast iron box under the floor, but I suppose things get smaller as the years pass by!

 

[JBR]

As the system develops, mainly as the gas supply reduces in the future, there is no knowing what additional equipment the DNOs/Suppliers will need. If space in the cabinets is taken by customers equipment it will lead to immediate problems.
That requirement has been in place and accepted since the cabinets were introduced in the late 1960s/early 1970s.

As for why the DNO requires a customer fuse.

Well it it operates late evening, that's the customer in darkness till morning, own fuse can be replaced

(Cynical one) If owing to a failure a fire starts, no fuse the DNO could be liable. Customer fuse customer problem.

Why should the DNOs provide electrical protection for excessive amounts of the customer's property. Where would it stop? The decision is 3m

As with equipment in cabinet requirement goes back 40+ years and is classed as a condition of supply.

Again, I apologise for not understanding the correct terminology which may be leading to my confusion, but the existing fuses in the old cast iron box is already about 30 feet from the CU. I assumed, therefore, that new fuses would be installed in the external box which will be just the other side of the wall to the existing cast iron box.
Would I be allowed to have an isolating switch, that I could operate if necessary, in the same exernal box (but before the meter)?

 

[JBR]

What about the question that a couple of us have asked. If the connection from meter to CU (or whatever) is in, say, steel conduit and/or SWA (not literally from meter, but from very close to it), does the requirement for a customer fuse when the distance is >3m still apply?

Yes it does, it's the customers property so the customer is responsible for it's electrical protection

I'd be happy to pay for an additional fuse adjacent to the CU, presumably because the distance from the external DNO fuse to the CU is about 30 feet.
Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, of course.

 

[EFLImpudence]

No, the fuse should be near the source of the cable.