The end of camp

[JBR]

I just detest that phrase "they dont build them like they used to" damn right it's called progress! !

You're right. Older cars were much more solid, with a proper chassis, but that made them heavier which had its disadvantages.

Modern cars may be made of metal as thin as bean tins, but being lighter makes them much more economical: smaller engines, more effective brakes, easier to steer, and so on.

One thing that I sometimes think I can do without, though, is some of the modern 'technology'. ABS is undoubtedly an important safety feature, but when everything is controlled by a computer, I begin to worry. The simpler a car is, the easier (and cheaper) it is to fix.

Or am I talking out of my ar$e?!

 

[EddieM]

No not at all. newer cars are impossible to work on. Re not being as solid as they were, absolutely true and absolutely necessary. In the event of an accident the key is as little kinetic energy and the slowest possible deceleration. The expensive bit of any vehicle sits in the seats.. the rest is there to protect and if that means severe deformation (crupple zones) then so be it.

 

[JohnD]

you have to remember that there were plenty of awful cars in the old days. Most of them have rotted away. The only old cars you see now are the ones that have been cared for and had a lot of money spent on them, and were probably the best of breed in their day. When Eddie was a boy, weekend suburban roads were full of dads lying on their backs tinkering with the things, because they went wrong so much. In my current car, the spark plugs are supposed to be replaced every 100,000 miles, and it does not rust.

A VW camper is a terrible vehicle in a frontal crash.

 

[Whitespirit66]

Rather than relying on heavy guage steel and strong, seperate chassis, modern cars rely on the intelligent forming and shaping/folding of thinner steel. Instead of trying to stop the car from being deformed, recent cars absorb the forces of a collision and transmit them to areas of the vehicle's structure where they can do least harm to passengers.

This does have a few downsides though, when it comes to repairing these cars. Have seen a few, where the obvios external damage where they had been hit looked repairable. On an older car, a panel beater would have had no trouble rectifying the damage. Trouble was, the car's clever crumple zones had transferred the deformation to less repairable and visible areas and the cars had to be written off.

, but when everything is controlled by a computer, I begin to worry. The simpler a car is, the easier (and cheaper) it is to fix.

Some of these hybrid cars coming onto the market now look like a nighmare for their future owners. The batteries cost a fortune. I think you lease them when you buy the car. They have a small petrol engine as well, to charge the batteries. The efficiency gains could be wiped out when these cars need repairs to what is quite a complex mechanical and computer setup or the batteries need replacing.

Technology is a wonderful thing, but with every step forward, we are less likely to be able to understand, let alone repair, the trickery under the bonnet.

 

[Whitespirit66]

The only old cars you see now are the ones that have been cared for and had a lot of money spent on them, and were probably the best of breed in their day.

Not always.

http://www.morrismarina.org.uk/

 

[Big Tone]

Nope the truth!! Annoying facts such as a pre 70's "sports" car will be out accelerated out braked out performed and out classed in every way by an astra 1.9 TD. Old cars... just that.... old fit for recycling only.

I just detest that phrase "they dont build them like they used to" damn right it's called progress! !

Ahem...

I drive many cars at work and most, (but not all), are modern crap! The Octavia has a magnetic catch on the boot which doesn’t release well; so we have all at some point tried to pull it open because it should be open but isn’t: nearly wrenching a tendon in the process. You have to stand on one leg singing alleluia for it to open.

If a car stalls you can’t just turn the ignition key because some smart ar$e thought that was too easy. So you have to turn it completely off and back on again.

The Pukegeot 206 is throwing a hissy fit for the third time in as many years. ‘They’ still don’t know what it is but have changed Lambda sensors and F knows what else, to no avail.

So we just drive it around now and accept it as a fairground ride like a bucking bronco. Oh, and because of all the so-called efficiency and boasts that it’ll go for three miles just on the smell of an oily rag, it wouldn’t pull the skin off a rice pudding. Talking of which...

The mpg figures are completely fabricated! They’re better than my 23 year old Micra, just, but I get 44mpg average and, (unlike their fudging figures), can get that figure with the mirrors on and brake pads in situ.

When I use the indicator on my old car it has a proper switch. Left indicates left; right indicates right – simples! The Astra and Octavia have some electronic PIC, as it’s known. So to turn the indicator off I have to say a prayer and roll a dice until I get a six. But after several attempts to turn it off and it flashing right, left, right, left in doing so – I manage to get some nebulous sweet spot with the woolly lever totally bereft of any feel finally does something I want it to do.

I could go on but yeah, they call it progress all right...

 

[ajrtd]

and it does not rust.

If you bought that car you said intending to buy then it certainly won't rust but it might corrode.

 

[JBR]

you have to remember that there were plenty of awful cars in the old days. Most of them have rotted away. The only old cars you see now are the ones that have been cared for and had a lot of money spent on them, and were probably the best of breed in their day. When Eddie was a boy, weekend suburban roads were full of dads lying on their backs tinkering with the things, because they went wrong so much.

I'm sure that when Eddie was a boy cars had not yet been invented.

 

[JohnD]

my previous few cars didn't rust either, because they were made of Zintec (zinc-coated rolled steel)

An E-type was rusty before it left the factory. A Mini had uncontrollable rust in body seams and rear subframes; also the doors fell off in quite modest crashes. My first Alfa had severe structural rust within five years of build, and was fit only for the scrapyard at seven. It was on its second engine by then.

Even your Morris Minor had severe rust in wings, sills and doors, though it took a while for the chassis to rust through.


A fifteen-year-old Carina:
View media item 700 View media item 698

 

[JBR]

my previous few cars didn't rust either, because they were made of Zintec (zinc-coated rolled steel)

An E-type was rusty before it left the factory. A Mini had uncontrollable rust in body seams and rear subframes; also the doors fell off in quite modest crashes. My first Alfa had severe structural rust within five years of build, and was fit only for the scrapyard at seven. It was on its second engine by then.

Even your Morris Minor had severe rust in wings, sills and doors, though it took a while for the chassis to rust through.

I bought my first car (a second hand Vauxhall Viva) when rusty cars were all the rage. I remember that a product called Ziebart was recommended to be daubed everywhere you could possibly access in order to (attempt to) prevent rust.

I don't suppose anybody uses it nowadays, even if it is still available.

 

[EddieM]

you have to remember that there were plenty of awful cars in the old days. Most of them have rotted away. The only old cars you see now are the ones that have been cared for and had a lot of money spent on them, and were probably the best of breed in their day. When Eddie was a boy, weekend suburban roads were full of dads lying on their backs tinkering with the things, because they went wrong so much.

I'm sure that when Eddie was a boy cars had not yet been invented.

Not quite that old, but old enough to remember the dreadful cars of the 70's and 80's. Rust, unreliability comparitively very poor performance and shocking safety.

 

[Whitespirit66]

I bought my first car (a second hand Vauxhall Viva) when rusty cars were all the rage. I remember that a product called Ziebart was recommended to be daubed everywhere you could possibly access in order to (attempt to) prevent rust.

I don't suppose anybody uses it nowadays, even if it is still available.

Yes, still available.

http://www.ziebart.com/ziebart---home/protection

Years ago, if you owned a car with the small Ziebart shield-shaped sticker in the window, there was half a chance that your pride and joy wouldn't disintegrate in front of your eyes.

Talking of Vauxhalls, shame they didn't Ziebart their PA Crestas. Fantastic transatlantic styling, but rust

Luckily, Vauxhalls aren't so bad any more. Mine is 28 years old and no rust yet.

View media item 71033

 

[DiscoDancer]

Talking of Vauxhalls, shame they didn't Ziebart their PA Crestas. Fantastic transatlantic styling, but rust

Ahh the old vauxhalls of that era.
Having been a proud owner of a Cresta (later than PA though, maybe PB or PC), a FD Ventora and a FE VX4/90 at various times. I wish I still had them, even with their rust.

 

[Whitespirit66]

Talking of Vauxhalls, shame they didn't Ziebart their PA Crestas. Fantastic transatlantic styling, but rust

Ahh the old vauxhalls of that era.
Having been a proud owner of a Cresta (later than PA though, maybe PB or PC), a FD Ventora and a FE VX4/90 at various times. I wish I still had them, even with their rust.

I used to have a P4 Rover, which was relatively low maintenance on the body. Always wanted the PA though (or a late model twin headlight Humber Super Snipe would have been nice ), particularly for the wrap-around screens, fins, etc - but the bodywork would have given me nightmares. Would probably ended up galvanising the thing. The PCs are nice too, wouldn't mind one. Weren't as popular as PAs though and rare as hen's teeth now.