V2L

[securespark]

Mods: please don't move this thread - it has more to do with Electrics than might first appear.

V2L is "Vehicle to Load".

It is a feature on some electric vehicles where you can run mains electrical appliances from them. Not sure about other manufacturers, but Hyundai can support appliances up to 3.6kW.

I have seen videos on YT where Class I appliances are being connected as a demonstration of what the car can power - in one case a tumble dryer.

From an earthing point of view, is this safe?

 

[RandomGrinch]

Presumably the 'earth' would be commoned to the vehicle 'ground', so no difference for the cars occupants.
Would the outlet have an RCBO?
But as for using the outlet to power an external device, that sounds problematic?

 

[ericmark]

What is the difference between V2L and a generator? The generators we hired all came with an earth rod, I have wondered how you can hire earth rods, as once in not so easy to remove again. And also how to test the earth rod, although I have tested 100's of earth rods, the equipment is not common in the electricians tool kit as in most cases we can compare to the supply earth.

However one item is not a problem, problem arrives when multi-items are used.

 

[RandomGrinch]

What is the difference between V2L and a generator? The generators we hired all came with an earth rod, I have wondered how you can hire earth rods, as once in not so easy to remove again. And also how to test the earth rod, although I have tested 100's of earth rods, the equipment is not common in the electricians tool kit as in most cases we can compare to the supply earth.

However one item is not a problem, problem arrives when multi-items are used.

That might be the issue, I suspect the vehicles won't be provided with an earth rod!
And a not inconceivable situation - two vehicles parked next to each other at a picnic site, each powering an external class 1 appliance.
The grounds could be floating at quite different potentials!

 

[ericmark]

That might be the issue, I suspect the vehicles won't be provided with an earth rod!
And a not inconceivable situation - two vehicles parked next to each other at a picnic site, each powering an external class 1 appliance.
The grounds could be floating at quite different potentials!

Different potentials to what? Not to ground as not connected, and not to each other as not connected. Take two 12 volt batteries and with no interconnected wires measure between the two batteries and no voltage.

 

[RandomGrinch]

Different potentials to what? Not to ground as not connected, and not to each other as not connected. Take two 12 volt batteries and with no interconnected wires measure between the two batteries and no voltage.

Probably wrongly, I was considering the vehicle to be similar to a power supply; where the floating ground can be at quite a different potential to the earth.

 

[winston1]

If the vehicle supply is floating and only supplies one appliance earthing is not required or desirable. RCDs don’t work on floating supplies.

 

[RandomGrinch]

If the vehicle supply is floating and only supplies one appliance earthing is not required or desirable. RCDs don’t work on floating supplies.

That's what I'm trying to understand and again, I'm likely to be wrong!
But the ground wouldn't be floating for the occupants of the car; take the appliance outside of the car and the ground becomes floating, unless you have an earth rod?
...and two appliances outside, from two different car supplies could have floating grounds of different potentials?

 

[winston1]

But the ground wouldn't be floating for the occupants of the car;

Why not?

from two different car supplies could have floating grounds of different potentials?

Floating grounds have no potentials. Nor is there potential between the two floating supplies.

 

[SUNRAY]

My gut feeling says no problem, however lets assume the 'neutral' is connected to vehicle earth and a faulty class II bit of kit manages to connect live to terra earth. The vehicle is now at 'mains' potential.

 

[winston1]

My gut feeling says no problem, however lets assume the 'neutral' is connected to vehicle earth and a faulty class II bit of kit manages to connect live to terra earth. The vehicle is now at 'mains' potential.

If one side is connect to vehicle earth it is no longer floating and a completely different ball game.

 

[bernardgreen]

Define "floating" and then consider stray capacitance between the apparently "floating" output and the source of it's energy

Petrol engine drives generator. Generator supplies power to the invertor that produces the 230 Volt AC supply

Petrol engine, generator frame and vehicle body / chassis are connected to the ground via the anti-static rubber of the tyres.

How much stray capacitive coupling (*) exists between the input to invertor and the output from invertor ?
(*) there may be intentional coupling as part of the design of the invertor

 

[SUNRAY]

If one side is connect to vehicle earth it is no longer floating and a completely different ball game.

It's usually the case with generators and invertors... and it's not always referenced to the dc -VE with invertors either.

 

[JohnD]

Vehicles are not generally earthed.

 

[RandomGrinch]

Why not?

Floating grounds have no potentials. Nor is there potential between the two floating supplies.

Albeit different circumstances, but the 'floating' ground from a switch mode PSU can have a significant 'potential difference', to the earth. The worst I have measured is 60V DC.
It's a common problem with Unibody Mac laptops using aftermarket, un-earthed PSU. Under the right circumstances, you feel the tingle!