lead to copper joints (wipe a joint)

plumber (new blood) · 11 Mar 2007

i require a gas fitter to give me a detailed description of how they would make a cup joint (lead to copper pipe) or `wipe a joint as it is also known.
I`am a qualified gas fitter but have very little experience of making cup joints as i never really come across lead gas pipes. I would be greatful for any feedback on this topic, thankyou.

doitall · 11 Mar 2007

Bell the end of the lead out and clean the inside with a knife. tin the end of the copper and stick it in the end of the lead pipe, clamp in place.

Fill the gap with lead solder (not leadfree) and wipe it with the end of your finger, Em maybe not I have asbestos fingers, best to use a cloth

Don't forget the flux, Yorkshire traditional is best but laco does work.

ChrisR · 11 Mar 2007

I don't know, I've done this a dozen or so times:

Clean inside the lead pipe (Cu fitting wire brush is OK)
Clean pipe
Flux inside lead (Laco is fine, you don't need Lard!)
Knock the copper into the lead (heavily inturned end helps)
Heat the whole area evenly then concentrate more on the copper, applying solder (leaded, lower mp) to the joint.
Make sure it's run round
Wire wool it if you're posh
Wonder what the fuss is about.

The first few times I tinned the end inch of the copper pipe with solder, which is probably a good idea for the minute it takes.

I do possess plumbers black, moleskin, Type D and tallow, but can't remember why.

bripl · 11 Mar 2007

tsk tsk dia you know it should be replaced

ChrisR · 11 Mar 2007

Naturally assumed it could only possibly be for drain pipes...

bripl · 11 Mar 2007

of course chris

doitall · 11 Mar 2007

bripl said:
tsk tsk dia you know it should be replaced

If operatives encounter lead in an existing installation, it may be left in use or repaired provided that it is in good condition, adequately sized and gas sound.

Corgy Essential gas safety then go on to explain how to connect an extension to an existing lead supply.

bripl · 11 Mar 2007

doitall wrote

If operatives encounter lead in an existing installation, it may be left in use or repaired provided that it is in good condition, adequately sized and gas sound.

common sense tells me it has outlived its purpose so pull it out, testicles to what it says in the book and you should know better as you are older than lead gas pipes

doitall · 11 Mar 2007

Last Irishman I spoke too, thought a gas pipe was another name for a phone.

bripl · 11 Mar 2007

good job i was taught by the brits

to tell the difference

namsag · 11 Mar 2007

About 20 years ago while fitting some wall heaters . Lead pipe coiled up under boards start pulling it out till it stops few sharp pulls on it and it won`t budge, have a look and its still connected to the gas lights which still worked oops.

doitall · 11 Mar 2007

My gas lights still work as well.

fitz1 · 11 Mar 2007

how do you legally blank a lead gas pipe.dont forget you can only use a recognised fitting.

kevplumb · 11 Mar 2007

cup joint copper tail yorkshire stop end

or you flatten the end and wipe the seam as it was always done

plumber (new blood) · 11 Mar 2007

thanks for that DOITALL and CHRISR, very detailed response. a few other small points tho....is it best just to apply heat the copper pipe ? what tool is used to form a socket on the lead pipe? is it called a turn pin. i should think a shave hook is ideal for cleaning the inside of the lead.

also i would only use this jointing method where i have no other options. for example a lead gas pipe to an appliance under laminate flooring, and the job requires some of the gas pipe to be replaced, as lead lock is not used on gas pipes i only have two options , replace all the lead pipe..or make a wiped joint.

i would normaly remove all lead and replace with copper, but the skill of being able to wipe a lead joint when it comes to gas fitting is very important and should not be seen as old school as on the odd job it will get you old of trouble, a skill gas fitters should not loose i believe, maybe i should be included in the A.C.S..... a reflection of the real day to day things fitters come up against.

Once again thankyou very much for your responses.

diynot

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lead to copper joints (wipe a joint)

namsag

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