Help for boiler installed without Bypass and without overrun

[Dan Robinson]

Ostell, sorry, but you are talking complete cobblers.

As was the judge.

Stop trying to teach us our jobs it makes you look very silly.

The judge knows less about boilers than you do - which is saying something.

Like I said you were very lucky to get that sort of judgement - and the original installer didn't help himself by putting up such a pathetic defence. But then if he thought a sample wiring diagram from a zone valve manual overrode the boiler instructions then it is clear he isn't very bright.


I am not defending the installer. I am merely being devil's advocate.

 

[petit_pablo]

From your b*****s comment I presume that you are a "qualified" installer and know what you are talking about. Where would you wire the pump? Go work out what happens if the heat is on and there is no water flowing.

Not much would happen tbh, if the boiler fired up without the pump running the boiler would quickly shut off again as the temp sensors would throw a fault up.

The sensors seem to be thermistors on the input and output pipes therefore no flow = no detection. Will eventually detect but too late. If what you say is true then why did my boiler bang and crash. Explosive boiling due to lack of flow I suspect. The very thing that pump over run is meant to control.

Seeing as you know so well how a boiler works, you would know that the ultracom looks for a temp increase on start up. If it doesn't see that increase within a certain time frame it will shut off.

Sure it banged about a bit but it wouldn't have done any damage.

 

[Ostell]

Let's get this straight, I installed the original system 25 years before this so called expert changed the boiler. This was the second heating system I had installed. The first one is still running, albeit with a change of boiler so the rest of the equipment must be over 35 years old now. And helped with another 3 systems. Not bad for DIY.

I didn't do the change myself for several reasons. I knew the regs etc had changed, I'm not allowed to touch gas and didn't want to spend ages looking up the regs and requirements for the latest boilers and have to buy tools again. Beside the old body is no longer capable of doing the work (that's why I have a blue badge). I relied on the installer to comply with the regs and install in agreement with them.

The judge tried to get to the details of what had happened but the installer just couldn't answer when asked specific questions by the judge. Many times the judge told him to answer the question asked and not go wandering on about other subjects. In one question the installer was asked to explain the difference between the original boiler (big cast iron chunk) and the boiler he installed (condensing). The installers response was that there was no difference. I suppose not, they both heat water!

Why should I have to suffer because of a not very bright installer? I believe the judgement was that he had broken the contract by not installing to a satisfactory quality. I'll find out for definite when I get the paperwork.

 

[Dan Robinson]

 

[Steelmasons]

......and another clueless DIYer who thinks he knows it all.

 

[Ostell]

......and another clueless DIYer who thinks he knows it all.

When did I say I knew it all? Certainly not clueless, eventually picked up sufficient additional knowledge to know what the installer had done wrong, though he couldn't see his mistakes. I suppose you know it all, like the installer I used.

Because I knew there had been a lot of changes I used an installer but to be honest I think he knows less than me. Even those in the trade that know him are not impressed by him.

Yep the original system was speced by me, with all the room calculations and pipe size specs etc, and worked for 25 years till the boiler got somewhat old. Bit better than the 18 months that the installer managed.

Domestic heating specification and installation is not exactly brain surgery but it does help if installers know what they are doing. He did originally manage to wire the 3 zone valves incorrectly in that they latched on until the last thermostat turned off.

The question I asked was how can I stop this installer making a mess of it for others? Or should he be stopped?

 

[I Like Sleeping]

And I would wager that the original installer was hammered on price.

 

[Ostell]

And I would wager that the original installer was hammered on price.

You would lose. The original installer was myself. in the days when I was a lot fitter and nimbler than now. Though I must admit I did get a reduction from the wholesaler who supplied the kit.

 

[Dan Robinson]

aaahhhh -a labour only tyre kicker.

It is all beginning to make sense.


By original installer Trimster meant the one who struggled with S plans.

I thought that was obvious?

 

[RF Lighting]

Sounds like a typical rouge customer to me. Goes for the cheapest labour only installer he can find and then is surprised when he's not very good.

Can't imagine any decent installer taking on a job where the customer supplies all the gear. I certainly wouldn't.

 

[Ostell]

Do plumbers have problems with reading, like the guy that messed up the boiler install for me?

Original, ie 30 years ago specd and fitted by me. Replacement boiler 5 years ago that lasted less than 18 months till the first serious fail was specd, supplied and fitted by the installer. No argument on price, accepted his quote as it seemed reasonable at the time, though he did charge extra for the TRV's.

Perhaps the above answers all the inane comments?

 

[Steelmasons]

What make and model was the original boiler?

..........and to say there may be an issue powering the circulator via the motor valve end switches is laughable.

In reading your posts it is clear the original installation (25/30 years ago) was/is a complete lash up.

BTW...What controls did you install on the original system? , ie: 'S' plan , 'Y'.............

 

[Steelmasons]

.

As to replacing the rads and boiler. The rads were 25 years old at the time and a high probability that with the amount of sludge being produced in the system the walls of the rads had been corroded so much that they were thin and liable to pin holes. The boiler was forever banging and crashing, stressing the heat exchanger and not exactly conducive to a long service life. The circulating sludge would also be grinding away at the innards of the heat exchanger, as it had to the bearings of the (2nd) pump.

Had YOU of installed this system properly then you wouldn't be in the situation you are in now.

maybe your family should be taking YOU to court for installing a system that wasn't fit for purpose.

 

[Dan Robinson]

Cue frantic googling .

 

[Steelmasons]

Cue frantic googling .

Yes Dan.

Let's hope the OP Google's the correct boiler.