Is the NHS up for sale?

[fillyboy]

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/poli...oint-plan-for-a-better-britain-20191203191392

THEY’VE told me not to get involved in this election. So I won’t. I like Boris a lot and everyone should vote for him. Here’s my plan he’ll follow:

1: Brexit. They say you’ve been talking about how you should Brexit. I say that’s like talking about how you should leave a room. Just walk out.

2: America is doing so great. You wouldn’t believe how great. A lot of the great things we’re doing people don’t even talk about, that’s how great. And you’re Great Britain, so why would you want trade deals with anyone not great? So only trade with us.

3: All the boring stuff? We’ll take care of it. Healthcare? We’re the best in the world. You want that. Police? There are so many movies about how incredible our police are, you can’t imagine. Roads? We’ve got freeways. They’re better.

4: I’ll make Scotland part of Britain, okay? They want that. They love me up there. So when I take over, Scotland’s part of the deal. I’ll pay. That’s on me. I’m a very generous guy.

5: The BBC, that’s a problem. The things they say about me? That’s got to stop. We’ll give the BBC to Piers. Perfect.

6: In the World War, the good one, our GIs came over here and stayed with British families. Made love to their beautiful daughters. We will bring that back. Forcibly if necessary. That’s a promise.

7: Real football. Because the football you have, that’s this thing the Brazilians invented because they couldn’t get NFL broadcast rights and it’s cheap, it’s bad, it’s no good. With Trump you’ll get the real football with quarterbacks and cheerleaders. We’re done? Okay. Vote for me.

 

[Notch7]

Theres an article about Durhamplumber just below the one fillyboy posted

A MAN who has spent three years ranting about Brexit is not planning to vote on December 12th if it is cold that day.

Norman Steele, aged 52, has droned on about Brexit in the pub, at work and at home, but admitted that he is not braving icy conditions just to do something as unimportant as voting

 

[EFLImpudence]

Good grief, Fillyboy.

You shouldn't have posted that. Durhamplumber will be wetting himself and believing every word.

 

[sodthisforfun]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eLZA6zt13PAmOuS8w1Xnf848pTx4MzJC4SWZwCKJOPyF4

Uh-oh.

 

[festive]

Times Boris has talked about Privatising the NHS.

Ten more times Boris Johnson backed NHS privatisation
“And this is not as trivial as it sounds, because we need to think about new ways of getting private money into the NHS. If you look at the countries that do better on cancer survival rates, and on coronary heart disease – countries such as Belgium, Germany or France – they do not rely on a monopoly state provider. They have a variety of systems – employer-based insurance schemes, employee-based insurance schemes, whatever; and they manage to spend more per capita on health, and to achieve better results, because they do not just rely on general taxation and spending – the first being electorally unpopular and the second being inefficient.”

Boris Johnson, ‘Friends, Voters, Countrymen’, 17 June 2002, page 15, link
“Why shouldn’t the Tories continue to match Labour funding on the NHS, but try to find ways of bringing in additional, private money?”

Boris Johnson, The Spectator, 12 May 2001, link
“Perhaps that extra money should come not just from taxation but from the kind of insurance-based schemes they have on the Continent.”

Boris Johnson, The Spectator, 2 June 2001, link
“Of course it would be better if there were more choice in the NHS, and more opportunity to buy optional services – but that is another story.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 20 December 2001, link
“At the risk of tempting him into a departure from Labour’s approved ideology, I invite him to agree that it shows what private enterprise can do in the field of health care.”

Boris Johnson, Parliament, 2 July 2002, link
“One way or another, Gordon will have to give us our money back next week, in tax cuts or spending, and at last Labour seems to understand that the answer is not always and everywhere an expansion of the public sector. Look at the NHS, where ministers finally seem to accept – after abolishing tax breaks for private insurance and persecuting consultants in private practice – that private beds will be necessary to stave off a flu crisis this winter.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 2 November 2000, link
“They don’t seem to have anything very interesting to say about the continuing crisis in the NHS, obsessed as they are with the monopolistic, top-down, state-driven solutions. They’re banishing the good consultants who want to do some private work, and they’ve done their best to make private health insurance unaffordable for the elderly.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 7 December 2000, link
“One of the reasons why the NHS is no longer the envy of the world is that it is still top-down, statist and treats patients like serfs and dolts. To be fair to Blair and Labour, they recognise this, at least in their rhetoric. They talk endlessly about mixing in the private sector.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 14 June 2001, link
“The result, after five years, is that we have what is in many ways a deteriorating health service, and an unhappy “Third Way” compromise between Prime Minister and Chancellor. Private firms are increasingly involved in NHS infrastructure projects, but the taxpayer picks up the tab.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 5 December 2002, link
“Blair comes on all pseudo-Tory and says it is time to end the “monolith” of NHS provision. Gordon defends the monolith with the fundamentalist fervour of a mullah protecting that big black cube at Mecca.”

Boris Johnson, The Telegraph, 7 November 2002, link

Nothing more recent? This is decades ago..

 

[festive]

Well it seems all this spin about the USA and the NHS is just that spin bullshit. Nothing to do with GE.
Usual armchair experts on here peddling waffle.

 

[JohnD]

Oh, you think Trump never said this:

"Trump threatens to use US trade talks to force NHS to pay more for drugs"

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/05/15/trump-threatens-use-us-trade-talks-force-nhs-pay-drugs/

"Donald Trump is ready to use trade talks to force the National Health Service to pay more for its drugs as part of his scheme to "put American patients first”.

Mr Trump has claimed that the high costs faced by US patients are a direct result of other countries’ health services “freeloading” at America’s expense."

I suppose you think Buffoon never said he approved of private companies creaming off the profitable parts of the NHS either

Are you going to tell us Jeremy the Hunt didn't extol the profits that could be made by healthcare companies cherry-picking business from the NHS?

 

[JP_]

So funny really - yesterday Trump was saying "i don't know where this thing about the NHS came from, I never said it, it's all made up, I don't want the NHS".
Then the news showed him recently saying "everything must be on the table in a trade deal, including the NHS".

I guess, if a liar says something to another liar, does that mean it never happened?

 

[JohnD]

Fest likes Buffoon and he likes Trump, he won't believe anything bad about them.

He thinks that when Buffoon throws away the EU agreements and goes on his knees to the US, begging for a deal, any deal, must have it by following January, he will be granted favourable terms.

 

[SirGalahad]

Here is all the evidence you need. This is the US Pharma telling the US Trade executives of what they want - ie the end of NHS price controls which becomes word for word one of the objectives for the US/UK trade deal.

20 minutes in.

This video from January is US Pharma industry lobby telling US trade negotiators that US-UK trade deal is “an important opportunity” to deal with “artificially depressed prices” in UK - “dictated” via our “primary payer” system

The person speaking 20 minutes in is Brian Toohey

The words high;oghted in the transcript become the word for word the official US objectives (also below) on pharma for US-UK trade deal, a few weeks later. “market derived pricing”

“consistent with TPA” is referrring to the Trade Promotion Authority which has Congressional fast track trade powers and US negotiators must seek “elimination of price control & reference pricing which denies full market access for US products”

 

[SirGalahad]

The aim of the US is

1) End Nice controls on pricing so we pay more for the same drugs for no other reason than the companies can make more profits knowing people can't just stop taking medicines.

2) Open up the NHS so that US companies can provide services run at a profit- Jeremy Hunt tried this with his ACO model which is copying how the US delivers their healthcare.

3) End of GDPR so the US can get hold of our NHS health records. In the US with disparate organisations all having their own systems and different data schemas, the NHS is a holy grail with their unified coding and vasts amounts of data.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/us-tech-firms-want-access-to-10bn-nhs-health-data-zpqwkj6pp

So a Tory Brexit means you will pay more for your drugs, on top you will receive fewer services and end up paying more for less.

 

[Lower]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eLZA6zt13PAmOuS8w1Xnf848pTx4MzJC4SWZwCKJOPyF4

Uh-oh.

Uh-oh nothing.

Drugs are currently bought from private companies in US by the NHS on a commercial basis in the same way they are from private companies in the EU. NICE decides what we can and can't afford and if the privately run US companies want to sell their drugs to the NHS then they have to so on a commercial basis a price NICE decides is reasonable.

If a US company wants to raise its prices it already can, which is exactly the same as EU drug companies. NICE then either accepts the rise, sources an alternate drug from another supplier which means that the US company loses the business, or NICE withdraws the drug entirely if there isn't an alternate but NICE deems the price rise inappropriate.

 

[JP_]

• Raab, Patel, Truss wrote book calling for privatisation of NHS
• Hancock given £32k from thinktank calling for privatisation of NHS
• Johnson made speech calling for privatisation of NHS
• 2/3 of NHS contracts given to private companies since 2015
• But NHS “not for sale”

 

[sodthisforfun]

Uh-oh nothing.

Drugs are currently bought from private companies in US by the NHS on a commercial basis in the same way they are from private companies in the EU. NICE decides what we can and can't afford and if the privately run US companies want to sell their drugs to the NHS then they have to so on a commercial basis a price NICE decides is reasonable.

If a US company wants to raise its prices it already can, which is exactly the same as EU drug companies. NICE then either accepts the rise, sources an alternate drug from another supplier which means that the US company loses the business, or NICE withdraws the drug entirely if there isn't an alternate but NICE deems the price rise inappropriate.

Why do you think the USA drugs companies want to get rid of NICE?

 

[SirGalahad]

Why do you think the USA drugs companies want to get rid of NICE?

Exactly. I posted the above video of what US Pharma wanted and has now become defacto US Trade policy re talks with the US but somehow they want to deny that.

So we have BUYING POWER and the tories and their voters want us to end that because its unfair.

They say its unfair the US companies cannot price gouge UK drug users.

Taking back control.