Fitting an isolator between meter and consumer unit.

[ebee]

Instead of the now usual 6 core cable linking the panel to the keypad, this early system needed a 12 core.

Well I started out with 4 core alarm cable, the old traditional wiring for contacts and mats then progressed to 6 cores for those new fangled Racal 772 PIR detectors needing a +ve and -ve supply.
8 core was handy to allow an extra zone on the same cable run.
12 core enable one cable run to a junction to be split off locally.
There was a 20 core available but I never used that size.
Mostly 4s and 6s with a few 8s did me but I did use the 12s a couple of times.
The ID biscuit help change things later on.
My favourite though became the Gardtech EOL resistor and zone resistor methods etc.

Ihave recently looked to see if the old Optima or logic 4 cheapos are available to replace old power supplies/signalling from my shed and feed electric strike mortice locks with battery back up for my shed.
They seem to be obselete (and I noted the prices and comparisons of alarm cables has changed significantly too).

 

[securespark]

I fitted that when we moved in here in 1990. Never given me any trouble apart from changing the battery 2 or 3 times! I have 4 x 4 cores going to the keypad.

I think the Concept was a model they were learning on WRT the keypad connection. You say yours had 16 cores, mine had 12.

But the instructions for this one has 4 cores, which is odd because as I understand it, latter day systems use 6: 2 for power, 2 for comms and 2 for tamper.

 

[SUNRAY]

https://stex24.com/37007-helu-kabel-h07rn-f-1x25-mmqm-single-core-rubber-tube-line-ad-12.7-mm15.8-mm-105682?

Oh for double-insulated/insulated-and-sheathed tri-rated...

Flexible double insulated singles are available, including rubber which is more flexible than tri-rated. I cleared some stock out quite recently.

[ As has ben pointed out, theoretically 'insulated and sheathed' (although I'm sure you would struggle to find a sheath which did not 'insulate'!) ]
.... but isn't that exactly what morq implied?

I interpreted the

... Oh for ...

As: 'I wish' there is.
Rather than: There is.

 

[SUNRAY]

Well I started out with 4 core alarm cable, the old traditional wiring for contacts and mats then progressed to 6 cores for those new fangled Racal 772 PIR detectors needing a +ve and -ve supply.
8 core was handy to allow an extra zone on the same cable run.
12 core enable one cable run to a junction to be split off locally.
There was a 20 core available but I never used that size.
Mostly 4s and 6s with a few 8s did me but I did use the 12s a couple of times.
The ID biscuit help change things later on.
My favourite though became the Gardtech EOL resistor and zone resistor methods etc.

Ihave recently looked to see if the old Optima or logic 4 cheapos are available to replace old power supplies/signalling from my shed and feed electric strike mortice locks with battery back up for my shed.
They seem to be obselete (and I noted the prices and comparisons of alarm cables has changed significantly too).

Oh my goodness: My first alarm panel of about the same era used 3 wires for: +, -, combined alarm & tamper and the cable which came as part of the kit was the early grey coloured telephone 3 core (Blue, orange, green).
Again sorting out recently I disposed of the whole system which I decommissioned in 1992 and had been living in a box ever since.

 

[denso13]

How long before someone installs a 6-, 8-, whatever-way CU from Henlys and only uses it for plug-in solar...

People do a whole bunch of silly illegal things. It won't stop with plug in solar

 

[JohnW2]

People do a whole bunch of silly illegal things. It won't stop with plug in solar

They do, and it won't.

However, I don't think what morq mentioned would be illegal, or necessarily 'silly' - but, rather a possible exploitation of rules and regulations which were 'silly' (because they had not been adequately 'thought through') !

 

[denso13]

They do, and it won't.

However, I don't think what morq mentioned would be illegal, or necessarily 'silly' - but, rather a possible exploitation of rules and regulations which were 'silly' (because they had not been adequately 'thought through') !

Max sum of 2000w, would 8 plug in units be below that?

 

[JohnW2]

Max sum of 2000w, would 8 plug in units be below that?

Obviously not.

However, in terms of the legislation, is not that 2,000 W maximum, just like the 800 W maximum for inverter output, said to relate to 'per final circuit', rather than to 'per installation/dwelling? The plan seems to be that it is intended that G98 will eventually be modified to align it with the 800 W per final circuit (although we seem to know little about whether that will definitely eventually happen, or 'when'), so might the same not also ('probably' !!)apply to the 2,000 W limit?

 

[denso13]

The plan seems to be that it is intended that G98 will eventually be modified to align it with the 800 W per final circuit (although we seem to know little about whether that will definitely eventually happen, or 'when'), so might the same not also ('probably' !!)apply to the 2,000 W limit?

We'll really need to wait and see. I think there still has to be some sort of limit, whatever that is. If it is simply one per circuit then x number of circuits would give you x number of 800w units and who knows if it will be as straightforward as that. There is also the 16 amp per phase limit which may or may not change. Watch this space...

 

[ebee]

Well for a start the definition of what counts as and does not count as "circuits" in this particular situation could be a right dogs breakfast in the first place.

Case in point on one thought - take two nearly identical domestic installations with plenty of sockets and lights, one on a four way consumer unit whilst the other on a 12 way consumer unit.
The permissible maximum load on one installation is far higher than that of the other installation yet the expected maximum loads on both installations is pretty much the same.

Do we place a limit per circuit plus a limit on number/area served of circuits plus a limit on areas served plus is a granny flat on its own consumer unit included or excluded ?
Then whatever the final outcome of the rules how many people would make bizzare attempts to circumvent the rules intended or just ignore them or to be blissfully unaware of such?

 

[denso13]

we place a limit per circuit plus a limit on number/area served of circuits plus a limit on areas served plus is a granny flat on its own consumer unit included or excluded ?

Who knows, that's what we are waiting for.

Then whatever the final outcome of the rules how many people would make bizzare attempts to circumvent the rules intended or just ignore them or to be blissfully unaware of such

Such is life...

 

[JohnW2]

We'll really need to wait and see.

I've been saying since early on in these threads that all the recent discussion seems to be very premature, and hence at least partially speculative. Why can't people wait until 'we know what we're dealing with'(even if some of it is not fully clear), at which point a more sensible/useful discussion should become possible?

I think there still has to be some sort of limit, whatever that is.

I'm not sure what these 'limits' are all about. As far as the installation is concerned, the wiring etc. of the circuit one has 'plugged into' obviously has to be adequate, but I'm not sure of the perceived reasons for other (lower) 'limits' - and a circuit that is adequate for, say, 32A 'forwards' ought be be equally able to carry the same current ''backwards - and that would amount to some 7,360 W for a 32A circuit!

 

[denso13]

I'm not sure what these 'limits' are all about. As far as the installation is concerned, the wiring etc. of the circuit one has 'plugged into' obviously has to be adequate, but I'm not sure of the perceived reasons for other (lower) 'limits' - and a circuit that is adequate for, say, 32A 'forwards' ought be be equally able to carry the same current ''backwards - and that would amount to some 7,360 W for a 32A circuit!

Yes, more about the number of units. DIY plug in is different to adding 20, or however many, circuits and have them hanging off balconies and covering complete roofs.

Maybe one per circuit up to a maximum of whatever, in output or numbers? Who knows.

 

[JohnW2]

Yes, more about the number of units. DIY plug in is different to adding 20, or however many, circuits and have them hanging off balconies and covering complete roofs.

Sure - but, as I said, I wonder what is the thinking behind the concept of needing such a limit ?

Maybe one per circuit up to a maximum of whatever, in output or numbers? Who knows.

As you say, who knows? ! ... and people in these discussions seem to be adding an extra layer of guessing on top of the uncertainties that are already there!

 

[denso13]

Sure - but, as I said, I wonder what is the thinking behind the concept of needing such a limit ?

Because it was aimed at a simple DIY install and not a means of bypassing the rules that traditional solar installs go through?

Dunno.