Becomming a plumber.

[Bright_Spark]

hi all. considering a career change....

considering i am too old for youth training schemes...

i am thinking about becomming a plumber, now, i am at a stage where i need to train as quickly and as thoroughly as possible.

i am open to all suggestions.....

i know of a person who has done an 'intense course' ...a number of weeks at a training centre and cut a long story short, he is now self employed and selling his services accordingly and had no previous plumbing qualification...what is all that about and whats the general thought on doing this type of thing....

cheers

 

[micky p]

i would stay well away from these so called intense plumbing courses as they are not worth the £thousands they are demanding. If you just want to be plumber and not get involved with gas side then i suppose that course may be ok (but is still don't recommend it). It is not a recognised qualification they give u.

how ever if you do want to plumb central heating, boilers and other gas related plumbing then you will need to start with a nvq 2 plumbing or gas fitting course. you will then end up with your city & guilds ( most recognised qualification). they won't let you on a ACS gas training course unless you have this certificate to begin with.

I went to college for 3 years and i still didn't know half of what was to know. I m afraid it is experience that learns you the majority of it but you need that start from college otherwise it could go badly wrong from the start.

 

[ChrisR]

All depends who you are, what you already can do, what you already know, how motivated you are, exactly what you want to do, how fit you are...

 

[bster]

Say NO to intense courses - what can you possibly learn in such a short space of time.

I was going to do a short course 3 years ago but everyone in the trade told me to do the NVQ2/3 proper.
takes a while but you'll be a better plumber for it in the longrun.

 

[RigidRaider]

How fit are you and how strong are your knees? Have you tried working for 8 hours kneeling or squatting or lying on the floor with an arm under a bath? Then doing this for 5 days and recovering in time to start again on Monday?

 

[Paul Barker]

How do you get away with so few hours? I only get my second wind after the first 11 hours.

OP how close to Scarborough are you? Come and spend some time with me and you'll have a better idea of how to get started how long it will take what you can achieve at the end, how difficult the challenges.

I just employed a new guy with three years experience and all the right plumbing qualifications. In two days while I was at Worcester he and a labourer only managed to remove a dhw cylinder alter the pipes for a change to a combi, take onld boiler off wall.

I had to hang new combi drill new flu hole run gas pipe, pipe up to boiler run condensate (including dig soakaway) run fused spur earth bond boiler pipework, re route roomstat pipe work. I did my part in a day alone, the two of them took two days. I sacked them both on Tuesday this week when they turned up for work.

OTOH a completely unqualified person who taught himself to fit kitchens and bathrooms that I normally do the gas work for, had asked me to fit a new boiler in Pocklington. I am so stacked out I asked him to do it (after I had approved the location) and I would come through to commission and run the gas. When I got there yesterday morning I was very happy to put my name to it, his pipework was perfect to the millimeter, all soldered joints passed a visual inspection with flying colours and of course there were no leaks. The boiler was so level you could level the earth from it, he was digging his soakaway when I got there, he had done everything to such a high standard if a corgi inspector had sen it he would give him a job as a corgi inspector not just register him.

What I am saying is, the person makes the difference, not the papers.

Come with me a few days and see if you are the right person, the rest will follow.

 

[Paul Barker]

Just a quick thought.

Should the government have adopted the Laisait faire form of government instead of the you can't fart without a certficate and you must spend £5000 evey year on training and equipment and callibration.

Then the market would regulate itself. Mark the self taught completely unqualified K and B fitter would not be stacked out with high paying customers if his work were not to a high standard of excellence. He is more excellent than I am.Still Laisait faire doesn't give loads of jobs to quangos which all builds the empire of those in power.

 

[Softus]

IMO there are four main elements to the knowledge you'll need:

1. Technical and theoretical;
2. Practical;
3. Regulatory;
4. Product;
5. Business (if you'll be running one).

Er, five, main elements.

You can pick up all of these on courses, but it's like taking your driving test - you only really start to learn when you're out there in the real world.

Which means that there's also a 6th element, which is how to get yourself out of a seemingly impossible situation with nobody to help you and when all the merchants are shut.

This last one, particalarly, is not taught at college, AFAIK.

As some have said, being fit is going to be important; you don't need a body like Brad Pitt's, but you will need stamina, and forearm and wrist strength, and back health, and titanium knees. Personally, I use the best knee pads that money can buy.

I believe you're already a tradesman, so you have an advantage, especially if you're already self-employed, but attaching yourself to another plumber, at least for a while, is the only way you're going to reach your goal with any speed.

In my case, if it's of any interest, I did one month of half-time work with another plumber (for free), then started trading on my own, while continuing to work him part-time (still for free). This was after already having dabbled in plumbing for about 17 years (did own extension, changed cylinder, connected up new solid fuel boiler, changed css, learned the Water Regs back to front (mostly now forgotten)), and I still knew virtually nothing when it came to those crucial moments.

One tip I would offer - whichever path of learning you choose - buy several metres of copper and plastic tubing, some fittings of all types, some benders, a good blowtorch and soldering gear, a good pair of adjustable wrenches, and spend some happy hours on your own bending and soldering copper and making joints and in all permutations.

Another tip - spend a little time working out for yourself the cost of your time (to the customer) spent farting around working out how to solder something or making on a compression fitting in an awkward space, and compare the cost to that of using more expensive plastic and pushfit materials. Armed with this you'll be able to make a commercial decision about whether or not copper is best in all circumstances, and weigh it up against the aesthetics.

 

[RigidRaider]

Having dabbled in some light plumbing myself I would certainly agree that the cost element is the key. How do you do quality work, that won't require re-doing, at high speed, along with all the setting up and business management including collecting payment, that goes with the job?

There must be plenty of people who can do plumbing - but can they make it pay?

 

[Bright_Spark]

Thanx for the info fellas. i get the general idea that theses 20 odd week intense plumbing courses arent all theyre cracked up to be!

a couple of you have mentioned NVQ L2 and L3...now, i am above the age for a young persons training scheme (19) and i understand that whatever trade i am in, doing a L3 NVQ at this stage would prove difficult. purely because i am not 19 or under and the NVQ would have to come out of my own pocket as i probably wouldnt be able to obtain a sponsor for it!

now, can i have some suggestions on the following please....

are there any ways round this NVQ business?

it is absolutely paramount that i do an NVQ?

would an employer take me on and pay me more than £6/hour with a recognised qualification but no NVQ?

without an NVQ is corgi registration still possible?

really i guess what im after is somebody who either can tell me exactly what the score is or who can point me in the right direction so i can find out for myself.........

many thanks to all

BS

 

[micky p]

Thanx for the info fellas. i get the general idea that theses 20 odd week intense plumbing courses arent all theyre cracked up to be!

a couple of you have mentioned NVQ L2 and L3...now, i am above the age for a young persons training scheme (19) and i understand that whatever trade i am in, doing a L3 NVQ at this stage would prove difficult. purely because i am not 19 or under and the NVQ would have to come out of my own pocket as i probably wouldnt be able to obtain a sponsor for it!

now, can i have some suggestions on the following please....

are there any ways round this NVQ business?

it is absolutely paramount that i do an NVQ?

would an employer take me on and pay me more than £6/hour with a recognised qualification but no NVQ?

without an NVQ is corgi registration still possible?

really i guess what im after is somebody who either can tell me exactly what the score is or who can point me in the right direction so i can find out for myself.........

many thanks to all

BS

as for doing your ACS (which u need for corgi) you will need either a City & guilds in plumbing/ gas fitting or NVQ L3

 

[Rob]

depends on what sort of work you want to get into, if you want to stick to just plumbing then im sure an employer would be happy with this.

i dont think you can do L3 without employment. im asuming from your last post you dont.

you could always do a guild of gas fitters course its basically a 16 day/week course covering everything in heating/gas area. not sure how many collges run this orhow basic it starts

the training is the same style you get when training for CCN1.
i also beleive if you pass then this entitles you to take the CCN1
test.

personally id pay for the NVQ2 suffer it for 2 years and just try to learn as much as poss. then you got it for life

unfortunatlet now a days you cant do your ACS without some form of plumbing cert.

i doubt you'd get much more £6 an hour without qualifications.

when i started i was on £30, £55 with NVQ2

its worth it eventually !! just dont start and drop out!

sorry im prob waffling, but any Qs just ask, ive recently experienced it all!

EDIT to mikey, i beleive NVQ2 is all thats req. its to stop kitchen fitters!

 

[micky p]

Like the above post. you really need to be in some type of employment to get the experience otherwise you will really struggle with the ACs course. I did from leaving school and could live off £60 a week onwards. Now probably in your case you need a half decent wage to pay loans /bills etc and that is where it is so difficult when you are older as many employers won't take on a older man with bigger wages when they can get a Apprentice from college and pay them less to do the same job and have the same experience. Im afraid it is a case of 2 steps back 3 forward type of thing.

 

[htgeng]

I had a mate who helped me out one week to do a boiler/trvs/cyl upgrade. You should have heard him bitching about how tired he was! All he did was watch me, fetch me bits, sweep up and bleed the rads. Its very physical work and any desk jockey will be crying and complaining soon enough.

 

[ChrisR]

unfortunatlet now a days you cant do your ACS without some form of plumbing cert.

Has to cover specifically gas, doesn't it, so NVQ2 plumbing wouldn't help?