Riello Burner RDB won't start

[blancy]

Hi,

Would be great if someone could offer a bit of advice.

I ran out of oil a few days ago and just got a bit more. I've runout a couple of times before and just bleeding that long gold pipe on the burner whilst pressing the reset buton one or a few times has done the trick. this time though it wouldn't take. I tried a good 15 times and since read somewhere that this probably wasn't a good idea. After about the first 7 or 8 there were not so much bubbles as slightly odd coloured stuff coming out with the oil, for about 5 bleeds. Then after a couple more it finally fired and stayed lit, though after this it took though the water a good 5 minutes to get even vaguely above cold (unlike previous times).

Turned the heating on and left it a 30 mins. rads got nice and hot. v. hot water from tap (as normal).

decided to have a shower as it's been a few days due to the cold water! was ok but not hot like normal, gradually cooloing to moderately warm.

Came back down and look at the boiler and it had gone out.

Now it will not restart. It gets to the stage before the whooosh but never does that, or even tries to. Only tried maybe 5 times in last hour.

Any idea what could be wrong?


thanks

 

[Boilerman2]

Sounds like the photocell is faulty if you can unplug the Photocell from the control box and see what happens, if after about 15 seconds the burner lights up and then goes to lock-out 5 seconds later then the cell is faulty and should be replaced - a common problem with the riello RDB!!

 

[blancy]

thanks for the suggestion.

I've seen mention of the photocell whilst looking around earlier, but no description of exactly what or where it is.

http://www.online-presence.com/rdb.jpg

Anything to do with 1 or 2 in the pic? or does the question alone make you nervous about telling me!

cheers

 

[Boilerman2]

Unscrew the lid of the control box (item1 in pic) trace the cable from the photocell (item 2 in the pic) back to the control box (its one of the 2 plugs furthest from the front) un plug it and run the burner if the fan runs for about 15 seconds and then the flame ignites and runs for 5-10 seconds before the burner shuts down at lock-out the cell is faulty

 

[blancy]

Nice one

Will give this a go tomorrow morning and report back

thanks

 

[blancy]

Right I've given that a go. followed the photocell cable into the control box and unplugged it.

Tried it again and it made absolutely no difference.

This is what happens regardless of whether the photocell cable is plugged or unplugged:

1. press reset
2. boiler immediately starts humming loudlyish for 13-14 secs (sounds like is usually did)
3. bit of a click (like a wall mounted thermostat might make) then louder humming and a new kinda whirring noise for 5-6 seconds (sounds like it usually did)
4. all stops and reset light comes on again

No attempt to burn at all.


Any more things to try?

Thanks again


p.s. one difference between this time and previous times I've run out and bled was that funny coloured stuff coming out with the oil. kinda creamy / rusty colour. Could some tank sediment have clogged something up further up the line now (I cannot see a filter anywhere in the oilline in the house before oiline feeds into pump)

could my excessive pressing of reset during bleeding have caused something to fail?

 

[Boilerman2]

OK the fact that the burner locks out proves that the control box etc is working, the click you hear is the solenoid coil operating, the slighly noiser humm you describe is ignition

You have a fues lproblem check ALL the oil filters are clean and are not contaminated with Water it souns like water is present in the oil which is why you are getting a milky coloured liquid flowing from the pump you must draw all of this c**p through as it will wreak the oil pump

 

[blancy]

Thanks a lot for your guidance on this

The cream / orange stuff came out after about 10 reset bleeds yesterday (prior to that it was bubbles / oil). When this stuff was coming out with the oil I'd guess it was maybe 20% of what was coming out of the bleed valve (the rest being oil, no bubbles). Then after that the next few bleeds seemed to be all pure oil and then it lit (before going out after half an hour or so never to start again).

I can't see any filters in the oil line within the house or within the boiler, which may mean the only one is at the base of the old rusting steel tank outside (one of the stickers inside the boiler is dated 1989 so it's been installed at least 20 years - maybe filters weren't used so much then?)

http://online-presence.com/tank_filter.jpg

I guess I just turn the stopcock off then unscrew the red filter casing? Just checking as I've put a fair effort into unscrewing the red casing but it ain't budged. If that should definately unscrew I shall increase the effort I'm putting into it
If I do get it off, how do you clean a filter anyway or is it supposed to be replaced?



I thought yesterday it could be some of that funny coloured stuff blocking the jet, but no idea how to check that

 

[spraggo]

I would suggest you do not attempt to unscrew and remove the tank filter unless you have a new rubber seal at hand, as when you replace the bowl it will probably start leaking.
It is obvious that you are getting oil to the burner but the sludge that you are getting from the bleed screw needs to be flushed out of the oil line. To do this, you may find a fire valve situated at the bottom of the boiler between the pipe coming in from the tank and the flexible oil line going to the pump. If so, turn off this valve and disconnect the flexible oil line from the oil pipe, then put the end of the flexible oil line into a water tight container,such as an old glass milk bottle or pickle jar and open the fire valve and let the oil flow into the container until the oil is clear, then shut the fire valve and reconnect the line to the pump.
You then need to remove the back of the oil pump to get at the metal filter to clean that one. once that is done refit the pump cover, turn on the fire valve and then bleed the pump as normal.
Beware, this is a messy job and you will need plenty of old rags

 

[blancy]

Thanks guys. Really appreciate it. I'll post again when there are developments

 

[oilhead]

The funny coloured creamy stuff that has come out of the pump, if it was there during the many times you pressed the reset button, will have seen the end of the oil pump.
Call in someone who knows what they are doing, and keep a closer eye on your fuel level in future.

 

[blancy]

Something along the lines of

10 resets - oil n bubbles
followed by
4 resets - oil with a bit of odd coloured stuff
followed by
5 resets - clear oil
1 reset - started

then went out after half an hour. Maybe 6 resets since but never tries to burn.

Gonna see if I can do what Spraggo suggested. If I can't, or if it doesn't work I'll leave it and call someone when funds allow. Sod's law isn't it. If I had the funds I wouldn't have run out in the first place.

As an aisde, does anyone know roughly what the cost of a replacement pump would be?

 

[spraggo]

As an aisde, does anyone know roughly what the cost of a replacement pump would be?[/quote]

You won`t see much change from £100.00p

 

[blancy]

An update:

I wasn't too keen to start pulling too much stuff apart so ended up calling out the plumber.

The filter at the tank was pretty old and not really functioning anymore, which meant that crap was bypassing it.
After replacing the filter and clearing the oil line of air and crap still no joy. new jet & cleaned filter/strainer on the pump still no joy, so the pump has indeed had it. New one coming in next day or two. Not got a price yet but with the callout and the labour it's gonna hurt

On the brighter side, plumber was friendly and showed me what he was doing so next time I run out I'll be a bit better equipped to troubleshoot.


Thanks for the pointers folks. Seems you were all on the right track

 

[blancy]

An update:

The original pump was shot (and had gunky filter) so plumber replaced it and started it up and left. It went again within half an hour. New pump was clogged and wouldn't move.

Not wanting to waste more money I took oil feed pipe off myself and there was a lot of brown crap in the oil feed. Pulled 60 odd litres through until it was pretty clear.

Had to have another new pump


I thought (hoped) they might not charge for the second pump & labour as I feel they didn't check the oil feed very thoroughly initially (I've got 3 litres of muck that I retrieved from it after the first new pump went) .


So just after a bit of feedback before I talk to them about this second bill.

Thanks