wiring new kitchen

[BAGGIES1]

Hi,
I am wiring new kitchen at moment.
just wondered if anyone could advise on some specifics.

I will be installing 4 double sockets. A large 50amp cable for electric cooker seperatly and 3 strip lights.

I am happy with my cable specs for the electrical cooker. It will sit on its own 50amp fuse and appropriate ampage cable.

I am mostly happy with the 3 strips lights. The current house fuse is 6amp for lights. Should i just tag on 3 strips lights to exisitng 6amp lights circuit??

Also the 4 double socks i want to install. I will want to run them off a single cable. Bearing in mind that it will most likely feed, a kettle, washing machine, dishwasher, tumbledryer, microwave, fridge, freeze (but NOT electric cooker). What would suggest as far as cable amp rating? Am i wrong to feed them all off a single cable from fuse box?

Any advice would be great thanks.

baggies1

 

[didthathurt]

There's no such thing as an "Amp cable". A cables max load depends on it's size and the way it is routed and secured. That said, a 10mm cable will suffice for your cooker under most normal conditions. The current 6A lighting cct should, unless you have unusually heavily loaded lighting units, suffice for the lighting.

Now the sockets. IMHO yes, you are wrong to run them off a single cable from the fuse box. What you describe is a lot of power! You need to create a separate kitchen ring main using 2.5mm T+E cable off a 32A CB. A single cable would create a radial cct whose 20A max load would allow for only 4.6kW which you'll certainly exceed on what you describe. Good kitchen electrical design, these days, also tends to separate the fridge/freezer power from the rest to prevent an RCD trip on the ring turning them off as well.

Time to be honest with yourself, this is such a basic piece of standard cct construction if you are not sure of this do you really know enough to guarantee the lives of your family on the standard of the job you'll do? Just because electrcity doesn't smell when it leaks or make a puddle it seems so easy to do. Cock up's kill people very quickly. It's part P time again! This is notifiable work that must be declared to the LABC.

 

[didthathurt]

And yes, I did hit the "Quote" button instead of the "Edit" button. This is all left handed as my right is in a plaster cast at the mo (that's why I've got the time ....)

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I'll remove the spare one if that's OK

Mod Rupert

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[Taylortwocities]

didthathurt, you beat me to it. I am 100% in agreement with you.

Makes me weep this sort of post.

 

[BAGGIES1]

that was my first post and i wos looking for a little help...

so glad your amused...


what a waste of my time...

i sure i dont have the experience wiring houses but i did spend 4 years at college studying electronics and built and designed electrical navigation boxes in the offshore industry 20 years ago....your comments are well off...i just wasnt dumb enough to design "ring main circuits"...

could you even tell me what a basic jk flip flop circuit does and how its designed, its possible uses?? no? oh right there not used in houses....ahhhh well i hope you never have to go on a forum to find out!

i didnt just get off the bus mate...

perhaps you think i put my family in danger or perhaps you think you just better than me....
or perhaps you dont like the idea of people putting leccy's out of pocket......

perhaps........... i'll try another forum...

 

[didthathurt]

Don't get upset, I am purely concerned that I don't give advice that is then used unadvisedly to create a dangerous situation.

I was in aircraft engineering, and would no more expect a line avionics engineer to wire my house than I would expect a part P electrician to diagnose a radar fault. I did, however, learn to understand my own limitations. If I needed a jk flip-flop designed I would have delegated the job to one of my guys who was competent in that field. That is all we are questioning. We are all competent in our own fields, lacking knowledge in another area is not a reflection on our own personal worth. Your post did indicate a lack of knowledge in this field, so everything written is relevant and pertinent. If you feel sufficiently insecure in your own ability you choose to vent that on those who have taken the time to pass on their knowledge and experience, you should, perhaps, seek the knowledge you need in a manner you feel exposes your self perceived shortcomings to a lesser degree.

Good luck with the job - do remember that without the certification required by law you may find your insurance is voided and any future property transaction prejudiced.

 

[securespark]

What, and get shot down twice? You want advice? Fine! It's just that the advice we give is not what you want to hear.

You need to know EXACTLY what you're doing before messing with electricity. The pro's here (me included) can smell a potential disaster a mile off.

The things that raised suspicion were: 50A fuse. First, you would not normally install a 50A fuse for a cooker circuit.

2nd, you said you were happy with the cable size, but didn't say what it was.

We're not worried about putting sparks out of pocket, if we were, we would not post any advice at all here other than "call a spark".

And finally, we (well certainly I) was most definately not amused. I was shocked.

 

[securespark]

Didthathurt....

You can have a radial in 4mm2 @ 32A. What's wrong with that? Think you were a bit hasty assuming it would be a 20A 2.5mm2 circuit.

 

[didthathurt]

Yes, I agree. I did make that assumption. I assumed that as 4mm is not a commonly used cable size (ie not available in a DIY store) that a 2.5mm would be used as that's what the average guy in the street associates with sockets on a circuit. But you are right, I could just as validly have advised a 4mm radial.

 

[JohnD]

Must be a Ring enthusiast like me

 

[securespark]

I'm not into Rings!

They are a PIA when they go wrong, they can be easily abused, and problems can occur when one section of the circuit is heavily loaded.

Radials are much better. If a fault occurs, at least the whole floor doesn't go down...

I remember my Grandparent's house in Golders Green. It was wired in 1945 when it was rebuilt after being bombed. Each socket (not that there were many in those days) had its own fuse, and there were 5A and 15A roundpin outlets, placed where there were most needed.

I'm not saying we should go to the extreme of one fuse per outlet (although that would help with fault-finding immensely!!), but I truly believe radials are the way to go.

 

[Spark123]

could you even tell me what a basic jk flip flop circuit does and how its designed, its possible uses?? no? oh right there not used in houses....ahhhh well i hope you never have to go on a forum to find out!

Well I do like a challenge, is it two clocked RS flip flops (made up of Nand gates) linked together, used to divide a squarewave pulse by two isn't it?

 

[nozspark]

BAGGIES,

I too am from an electronics (avionics) background and know what a JK, shotky diode and most other electronic components are and could figure out how to connect them up for a desired purpose.
However when I left that industry to go it alone in the sparking world, I could not beleive all the things that I needed to know to wire a house etc up --- it was truly a shock to the system --- I am still learning.

 

[TheGaffersSon]

I've always been taught to use rings. Also 2.5mm is so much easier to pull in, especially for a DIY'er.

To the original poster, lose the attitude. As someone in the game it is obvious that you could put yourself and whoever else in a lot of danger. Sparks like these older lads on here are naturally concerned for your welfare, naturally.

Why give a load of ****e when they offer help? You'd be worse off if they said nothing.

I am an apprentice, you learn to appreciate what you are told from these guys even if you don't like it. Especially when you're about to carry out your own work.

Anyway, stick all your kitchen power on its own ringmain using 2.5mm cable, and a 32A breaker. Your breaker needs to match the make of your consumer unit.

The lighting can be 1.5mm twin and earth and can go on a 6A breaker.

The cooker should go on its own circuit, with possible a fuse spur (Connection Unit) at reach height. Use 10mm cable for this.

Lose the attitude before it harms you, good luck.

 

[JohnD]

Yay! go Rings!

(and RCBOs)