Spread them out across the whole of Europe and they will cease to be an 'issue'. Won't happen unless Europe 'works' as a whole.
A question to the pro Europeans.
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Spread them out across the whole of Europe and they will cease to be an 'issue'. Won't happen unless Europe 'works' as a whole.
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They are spread out. Go to any big city in mainland Europe and they live in dire poverty and send their kids begging on the street. What has that achieved?
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Another post for JohnD and Watchmaker:
Do you both remember Yugoslavia?
That was a country of disparate people held together under the government of Marshall Tito. What happened when Tito died? Do you remember?
Well Europe will be just the same. A super-state of disparate people held together by the rule of law until the wheels fall off the economy - then the result will be the same as in the old Yugoslavia but on a very much grander scale.
It isn't a cure for war in Europe - it actually sows the seeds of genocide and ethic cleansing.
Those that don't learn history's lessons are destined to repeat them.
Do you both remember Yugoslavia?
That was a country of disparate people held together under the government of Marshall Tito. What happened when Tito died? Do you remember?
Well Europe will be just the same. A super-state of disparate people held together by the rule of law until the wheels fall off the economy - then the result will be the same as in the old Yugoslavia but on a very much grander scale.
It isn't a cure for war in Europe - it actually sows the seeds of genocide and ethic cleansing.
Those that don't learn history's lessons are destined to repeat them.
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Beats me how you can try and force cultural commonality on so many diverse cultures, without it all ending in a lot of tears at some point.
There are a few good things (apparently) that have come out of the EEC/EC/EU; but this latest push towards federalism benefits only a few (thousand) continental as well as UK megalomaniacs, not the peoples of Europe as a whole. They refuse to listen to the will of the people qv the response to Eire's referendum and the continued refusal to let us have one.
It's progressed to the level of duplicity, mendacity, spin and denial of the people's voice that we've come to expect from our incumbent shower of shít in Westminster, just on a much larger scale.
There are a few good things (apparently) that have come out of the EEC/EC/EU; but this latest push towards federalism benefits only a few (thousand) continental as well as UK megalomaniacs, not the peoples of Europe as a whole. They refuse to listen to the will of the people qv the response to Eire's referendum and the continued refusal to let us have one.
It's progressed to the level of duplicity, mendacity, spin and denial of the people's voice that we've come to expect from our incumbent shower of shít in Westminster, just on a much larger scale.
Joe-90 wrote:
We are currently (allegedly) governed by the Labour party and not some corrupt tw*t in Brussels but we have freedom to live and work in other European countries which I believe is a good thing ... And works both ways.
I am in favour of this freedom but not in favour of a centrally governed Europe.
Hope this is finally clear to you now
If I could click my fingers and make a wish I'd have a World government and freedom for any human being to live and work anywhere on the planet but we are quite a way from this utopia
MW
No I didn't say that either Joe.
We are currently (allegedly) governed by the Labour party and not some corrupt tw*t in Brussels but we have freedom to live and work in other European countries which I believe is a good thing ... And works both ways.
I am in favour of this freedom but not in favour of a centrally governed Europe.
Hope this is finally clear to you now
If I could click my fingers and make a wish I'd have a World government and freedom for any human being to live and work anywhere on the planet but we are quite a way from this utopia
MW
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Joe-90 wrote:No I didn't say that either Joe.
We are currently (allegedly) governed by the Labour party and not some corrupt tw*t in Brussels but we have freedom to live and work in other European countries which I believe is a good thing ... And works both ways.
I am in favour of this freedom but not in favour of a centrally governed Europe.
Hope this is finally clear to you now
If I could click my fingers and make a wish I'd have a World government and freedom for any human being to live and work anywhere on the planet but we are quite a way from this utopia
MW
So you ARE pro European then - which is what I thought in the beginning. You can't be anti Europe if you would like to see population of Europe allowed into Britain whether it suits us or not without a referendum.
That is very much a PRO European stance. Europe is about people.
Megawatt wrote
Thats not utopia. That's a disaster !.
Why do you think Australia has such a tough immigration policy ?.
Already Ireland is feeling the strain of immigrant people. The health service in particular.
Many are genuinely contributing to society but alas many are not.
I work with a gang of Lithuians. Out of about 10 of them only one guy said he wanted to settle here.
The rest siphon the cash back home. And many of them are paid cash in hand.
Thats not utopia. That's a disaster !.
Why do you think Australia has such a tough immigration policy ?.
Already Ireland is feeling the strain of immigrant people. The health service in particular.
Many are genuinely contributing to society but alas many are not.
I work with a gang of Lithuians. Out of about 10 of them only one guy said he wanted to settle here.
The rest siphon the cash back home. And many of them are paid cash in hand.
As usual Joe your view of the World bears little relation to anyone else's.
If you ask anyone today what they think a pro-European is you will almost certainly get a response based on government not freedom of movement.
What % of the British population do you think would like us to become separated from Europe in terms of freedom of movement i.e. we cannot go and live/work in France/Spain/Portugal/Italy etc etc? ... Too low to be considered.
On the other hand ... What % do you think would keep us self-governed rather than centrally by the sprouts? ... A significant number.
Today's issue of Europe isn't about immigration or freedom of movement it's about Government and autonomy.
Where have you been?
MW
If you ask anyone today what they think a pro-European is you will almost certainly get a response based on government not freedom of movement.
What % of the British population do you think would like us to become separated from Europe in terms of freedom of movement i.e. we cannot go and live/work in France/Spain/Portugal/Italy etc etc? ... Too low to be considered.
On the other hand ... What % do you think would keep us self-governed rather than centrally by the sprouts? ... A significant number.
Today's issue of Europe isn't about immigration or freedom of movement it's about Government and autonomy.
Where have you been?
MW
Norcon ... You really don't get it do you.
Read all of my wish not just the bit you want to see ...
MW
Read all of my wish not just the bit you want to see ...
Of course this is utopia ... There would be no such thing as immigration/emigration in this scenario would there ... These things only exist as a result of segmentation of the World.
MW
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How do you know what everyone else thinks?
A policy of socially integrated Europe is PRO Europe. That's a fact.
Anti Europe would be to allow other Nationals WORK PERMITS to work in the UK.
Why would you want the beggars of Europe on our streets?
Why would you want it illegal to deport foreign criminals?
Why would you want foreigners who've never paid a penny towards the NHS to get a free heart transplant? (and a Brit could well die because the heart that could have save them went to a foreign national?)
Well?
As I've already said, this works both ways ...
What % of the British population do you think would like us to become separated from Europe in terms of freedom of movement i.e. we cannot go and live/work in France/Spain/Portugal/Italy etc etc?
Well?
MW
What % of the British population do you think would like us to become separated from Europe in terms of freedom of movement i.e. we cannot go and live/work in France/Spain/Portugal/Italy etc etc?
Well?
MW
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That's a f'in laugh...
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They can apply for work permits. If it suits the home nation they can grant them, if not - then they won't.
We have a shrinking economy, we are heading for recession. Brits are being forced out of work.
EEs are taking their jobs by working for a minimum wage that the Brit with mortgage and family cannot take.
You live in a different world down in Devon.
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