Architrave Finishing - Advice on gaps

[rystaman]

Afternoon all,

I've recently had a bunch of new frames, doors hung and new architraves in my house. For the most part, the architraves fit snugly with only 2-3mm gaps, which I reckon a quick bit of decorator's caulk will sort. However, a couple of them have disconcerting 10mm+ gaps. One of these is on a new frame and on a freshly boarded wall, which I believe should have made for an easier fit.

I'm leaning towards calling the chippies back to rectify these larger gaps, as they seem too significant to be managed with caulking alone. I also might get them to sort a poor cut on one of the architraves.

I've put some images below, be good to get people's thoughts if I'm being too fussy.

 

[opps]

I am guessing that the plaster finish on the plaster board is sitting proud of the door liners.

Caulk is not suitable for a 10mm gap. It will shrink back massively.

A fillet will work, but to be fair to them, they would need a bandsaw/etc to cut one.

At a push, if they refuse to rectify it, you can use expanding foam. Let the foam cure and cut away the excess. Then sand the foam slightly to leave it slightly below the surface. Then use a soft filler such as RedDevil Redlite to back fill it.

The scribed profile in image 4 is pretty pants, RedDevil will fill it but the tops of the architraves look to be at slightly different heights.

Again, image no 4, you will need a sharp chisel, or sandpaper to remove the paint build up running down original door liner.

I have seen worse. I have no idea how much you paid though.

 

[rystaman]

I am guessing that the plaster finish on the plaster board is sitting proud of the door liners.

Caulk is not suitable for a 10mm gap. It will shrink back massively.

A fillet will work, but to be fair to them, they would need a bandsaw/etc to cut one.

At a push, if they refuse to rectify it, you can use expanding foam. Let the foam cure and cut away the excess. Then sand the foam slightly to leave it slightly below the surface. Then use a soft filler such as RedDevil Redlite to back fill it.

The scribed profile in image 4 is pretty pants, RedDevil will fill it but the tops of the architraves look to be at slightly different heights.

Again, image no 4, you will need a sharp chisel, or sandpaper to remove the paint build up running down original door liner.

I have seen worse. I have no idea how much you paid though.

The plaster finish on the plasterboard looked like this around the door before the architraves were put on (it's the only image I've got as it was relating to the light switch on a different post so it's pretty crap in terms of showing it but I don't think was proud from what I can remember.

Looking at it, is it not the blob of silicon at the top making it stick out and the nail in picture 3 below doesn't look like it's been sunk enough.

In image 4 when you say the scribed profile which bit do you mean in that? Because that might be actually the old door frame. And let's just say it definitely wasn't the cheapest quote...

 

[opps]

They have made the gap between the door liner and architrave as small as possible. That has resulted in the architrave kicking out away from the wall- resulting in the big gap.

I wasn't intentionally criticising you for being tight.

Their options were to use a fillet along the door liner to make it level with the plasterboard wall, thereby minimising the gap with the plaster- or, if there were noticeably high spots at the end of the plasterboard, chisel/sand them away.

I wouldn't be happy with the work.

If was my customer's house, I would tell them that I needed to sand the plaster near the door liner first, and possibly use a fillet at the door liner architrave end. But I would then charge more for doing so.

To be fair, they were working with the new plasterwork, and I assume that they were on a fixed price.

Many chippies will look at a job, and literally only do the work that they were contracted to do. In their opinion, if your plastering is out of kilter, it isn't their problem.

 

[rystaman]

They have made the gap between the door liner and architrave as small as possible. That has resulted in the architrave kicking out away from the wall- resulting in the big gap.

I wasn't intentionally criticising you for being tight.

Their options were to use a fillet along the door liner to make it level with the plasterboard wall, thereby minimising the gap with the plaster- or, if there were noticeably high spots at the end of the plasterboard, chisel/sand them away.

I wouldn't be happy with the work.

If was my customer's house, I would tell them that I needed to sand the plaster near the door liner first, and possibly use a fillet at the door liner architrave end. But I would then charge more for doing so.

To be fair, they were working with the new plasterwork, and I assume that they were on a fixed price.

Many chippies will look at a job, and literally only do the work that they were contracted to do. In their opinion, if your plastering is out of kilter, it isn't their problem.

Oh no, I get that, but it wasn't the cheapest quote, so I'm not happy with this part of the work either.

They didn't mention any noticeable high spots at the end of the plasterboard, nor did my untrained eye and when sticking a level on it, it seemed pretty much bang on, hence why I was surprised at the gaps.

Tbf they're not, currently paid half of the work and the rest on completion so anything further would still be able to be added onto the scope. But I won't be paying the full amount until it's rectified.

The picture of the nail concerns me regarding the longevity of the architraves as it just doesn't look like they've got much support.

 

[mrrusty]

It's carp. If they've fitted new linings, doors and archs there are several different ways to fettle it for a neat job, and that isn't. The skill of a decent joiner is to tweak and fettle the job into the idiosyncracies of the house so it all looks right, not just throw the standard stuff at it and secure it where it touches, relying on filler to fill the gaps. When fitting you can shave the lining if it's a bit proud, cut back the plaster if that's proud and rebate the back of the arch it that works - all little ways of making a decent job. I wouldn't accept it.

 

[rystaman]

It's carp. If they've fitted new linings, doors and archs there are several different ways to fettle it for a neat job, and that isn't. The skill of a decent joiner is to tweak and fettle the job into the idiosyncracies of the house so it all looks right, not just throw the standard stuff at it and secure it where it touches, relying on filler to fill the gaps. When fitting you can shave the lining if it's a bit proud, cut back the plaster if that's proud and rebate the back of the arch it that works - all little ways of making a decent job. I wouldn't accept it.

Good to know I'm not alone in thinking this. Considering the price, and that it's on freshly boarded and skimmed walls. But no i'm not going to accept it. I've just looked at the other side of the living room too and there's a 17mm gap down the bottom! It frankly looks a bit crap

 

[johnny2007]

The door frame should be as levelled as possible to the plaster.
Whoever did the last job did it wrong.
Were the frames fitted before plastering or after?

 

[rystaman]

The door frame should be as levelled as possible to the plaster.
Whoever did the last job did it wrong.
Were the frames fitted before plastering or after?

The order was:

Frames
Plastering
Doors & Architraves

 

[mrrusty]

...then with those huge gaps I suspect the wrong casings were bought in - they are available in several different widths. Even so, a quick job with a circular saw before fitting to adjust them. Slapdash attention to detail and/or a lack of understanding of how the wall thickness builds up.

 

[johnny2007]

The order was:

Frames
Plastering
Doors & Architraves

The plasterer should've gone flush with the frame.
If the frame was sticking out too much he should've told the carpenter before plastering.
I take that the 2 don't usually work together.

 

[Notch7]

Good to know I'm not alone in thinking this. Considering the price, and that it's on freshly boarded and skimmed walls. But no i'm not going to accept it. I've just looked at the other side of the living room too and there's a 17mm gap down the bottom! It frankly looks a bit crap

the blob of silicone isn’t the problem

the problem is the door lining is proud of the wall…..so the issue was at first fix, ie when the door linings were fitted.

without seeing it, it’s not possible to know if the door lining is too wide or the lining has been fitted in a twisted wall - ie the door lining was fitted nice and flat so the door when fitted sits flat, but the result is the door lining ends up tapered going from flush to very proud over the length - this is a problem that should’ve been overcome by plastering

 

[Notch7]

The plasterer should've gone flush with the frame.
If the frame was sticking out too much he should've told the carpenter before plastering.
I take that the 2 don't usually work together.

I think this is the crux of the problem.

the failure is between first fix and plasterers

 

[rystaman]

the blob of silicone isn’t the problem

the problem is the door lining is proud of the wall…..so the issue was at first fix, ie when the door linings were fitted.

without seeing it, it’s not possible to know if the door lining is too wide or the lining has been fitted in a twisted wall - ie the door lining was fitted nice and flat so the door when fitted sits flat, but the result is the door lining ends up tapered going from flush to very proud over the length - this is a problem that should’ve been overcome by plastering

The door lining was fitted before plastering and the wall it was on actually had new boards and was skimmed onto. Found another picture of the plastering with the door lining visible.

 

[chirpychippy]

This is quite simply the carpenters fault, if the walls are new then the stud work should be bang on plumb, often door liners don't work with the combination of stud work and plasterboard x 2 and skim finish.

The door linings are to wide, they should of been ripped down to suit the overall thickness of the wall including the skim finish. The wall should be plumb, I have received wonky stud timbers from my supplier in the past, wonky wood, wonky wall, I refuse to use it.