Fuse panel hot unit, smell in corridor below?

[JohnW2]

Looking at the picture again, on the service head it may not be the case that the black wire goes into the fuse. ... There is a short stumpy box bit, then the longer fuse carrier bit - so the black may go to the short stumpy bit and the red to the longer bit. (Technical this.) ... Could well be an optical illusion throwing us out.

Whilst I agree that a 'straight on' photo would settle that once and for all, I find it hard to reconcile what you suggest with the photo, even allowing for the possibility of 'optical illusions'.

There is seemingly something smaller to the left of the fuse carrier, which could be a 'Henley' intended as a 'neutral block', but there is absolutely no sign of anything from the supply entering it - so if the black cable were connected to that, it would not be connected to anything!

The incoming supply clearly splits into two components, one connected to the bottom of the fuse carrier and the other heading off in the direction of where we first see the red conductor. The top of the fuse carrier is clearly the downstream end of the fuse, and it's almost impossible to see how the red tail could connect that, given that the black one is the only one seen anywhere near the top of fuse carrier. In other words, if one thought that it was an optical illusion which makes it look as if the black comes from the downstream end of the fuse, then what actually IS connected to the (top of) the fuse?

For those reasons, I find it hard to believe that things can be as you suggest - but who knows?! As I said, a 'straight on' photo which allowed us to see clearly what happens on both sides of the fuse carrier would presumably settle that particular question.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

I seem to have misled with this point, ... My meter was totally conventional with neutral in the middle, however when I purchased the property it was wired with red lives in the middle ...

Fair enough - in which case yes,, you did rather 'mislead' (at least me!) . That being the case, maybe it is true that (as sparkwright suggested) there is not a single-phase meter in the land that doesn't have the neutrals in the middle!

Kind Regards, John

 

[SUNRAY]

Fair enough - in which case yes,, you did rather 'mislead' (at least me!) . That being the case, maybe it is true that (as sparkwright suggested) there is not a single-phase meter in the land that doesn't have the neutrals in the middle!

Kind Regards, John

I've never knowingly encountered one and merrily gone through life thinking 'that's how they are'. The only variation being the 5th terminal and neutral removable link.

 

[Chunky19]

No doubt in my mind, it's just the angle of photo. The Neutral link is on the left "set back" from the much more protruding fuse carrier. Possibly using the right hand terminal in fuse to exacerbate the position of the red cable.

 

[JohnW2]

I've never knowingly encountered one and merrily gone through life thinking 'that's how they are'. The only variation being the 5th terminal and neutral removable link.

Fair enough. As I've implied, I certainly haven't personally seen a single-phase one which is otherwise.

What about 3-phase meters (of which I have limited experience) - is there a 'traditional convention' for those, too? By analogy with the single-phase ones, I might have expected something like L1-L2-L3-N-N-L3-L2-L1 - whereas, as I illustrated, mine is L1-L1-L2-L2-L3-L3-N-N.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Chunky19]

JohnW2 is correct, L1-L1-L2-L2-L3-L3-N-N is normal. With Single Phase three wire being L1-L1-N-N-L2-L2.

 

[JohnW2]

No doubt in my mind, it's just the angle of photo. The Neutral link is on the left "set back" from the much more protruding fuse carrier. Possibly using the right hand terminal in fuse to exacerbate the position of the red cable.

Interesting, but I still find it very hard to get my head around that suggestion.

Even if there is a 'side terminal' on the fuse holder (something I've never personally seen), to which the red is connected, where are you suggesting that the right-hand 'branch' of the incoming cable goes?

We definitely need a further 'straight on' photo to resolve this particular question.

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

No doubt in my mind, it's just the angle of photo. The Neutral link is on the left "set back" from the much more protruding fuse carrier. Possibly using the right hand terminal in fuse to exacerbate the position of the red cable.

What about the supply cables?

 

[JohnW2]

JohnW2 is correct, L1-L1-L2-L2-L3-L3-N-N is normal. With Single Phase three wire being L1-L1-N-N-L2-L2.

Thanks. When you speak of "Single-Phase 3-wire" are you referring to what many call "split phase", and which BS7671 calls "2-phase 180°"?

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

What about the supply cables?

Quite. As I just wrote:

....Even if there is a 'side terminal' on the fuse holder (something I've never personally seen), to which the red is connected, where are you suggesting that the right-hand 'branch' of the incoming cable goes?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, I now know.

We posted at about the same time.

 

[Chunky19]

The camera is looking across the underside of the fuse holder at an angle to where the neutral is connected further back in the neutral link. The incoming RH cable (that looks from the centre of supply cable) is also connected at the back of the fuse.
That style of fuse holder are quite deep.

 

[Chunky19]

Thanks. When you speak of "Single-Phase 3-wire" are you referring to what many call "split phase", and which BS7671 calls "2-phase 180°"?

Kind Regards, John

Yes 180° Not to be confused with Two of Three Phase. Which visually from cut-out perspective looks the same.
Use Voltmeter to confirm.

 

[SUNRAY]

Fair enough. As I've implied, I certainly haven't personally seen a single-phase one which is otherwise.

What about 3-phase meters (of which I have limited experience) - is there a 'traditional convention' for those, too? By analogy with the single-phase ones, I might have expected something like L1-L2-L3-N-N-L3-L2-L1 - whereas, as I illustrated, mine is L1-L1-L2-L2-L3-L3-N-N.

Kind Regards, John

3ph do tend to follow your layout but bigger versions can vary, one 2KA I saw had 3 individual N terminals but only big enough for (say) a 10mm² wire. I haven't such a big meter for a long while though.

 

[JohnW2]

The camera is looking across the underside of the fuse holder at an angle to where the neutral is connected further back in the neutral link. The incoming RH cable (that looks from the centre of supply cable) is also connected at the back of the fuse. That style of fuse holder are quite deep.

I obviously have no basis on which to disagree/argue with you, but we need a better photo (to convince me ).

Kind Regards, John