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Deleted member 174758
What, even if they are Welsh?
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Deleted member 18243
Pubs and churches have been systematically undermined by a succession of British governments since WW2. It is not that they are unwanted. The decline of pubs started in the early 60s when the govt permitted alcohol to be sold in shops - previously you could only buy booze in pubs. A further blow was the smoking ban in 2007, and the last straw was the compulsory closure of pubs during the covid years. Throughout all this there has been constant anti-alcohol brainwashing and unfavourable tax regimes for pubs and alcoholic drinks AND crucially in ghetto areas the government has replaced the pub going locals with third world immigrants who don't know a pub from a mud hut. If pubs are unwanted, it is due to deliberate and/or inadvertent government action.
Churches, and the Christian religion, have been under attack during the same period, mainly by mass media brainwashing. It is the done thing to laugh at devout Christians. Church leaders have not helped by following every fashionable cause. Last year covid, this year woke.
THROUGHOUT ALL THIS the govt not only allowed the spread of islam, but promoted it. Many pub and church buildings are now mosques and are entirely free of government interference. Islamic leaders have not changed their message one jot due to any fashionable cause at any time and anyone who criticises or mocks islam is "de-platformed": persecuted; prosecuted, sacked or worse.
I was recently in Boston, Lincolnshire - another hell on earth (more on this later) - and I have never been so glad to see a Wetherspoons. An oasis of civilisation. The place felt like an outpost.
They are disgusting places. I don't live there but know Glodwick and Werneth well. Every time I pass through the rot has spread further. Oldham centre is sad to see, if you knew it 30 or 40 years ago as I did.
Most people out there are easily brainwashed and don't know the reality. The reality is kept from our screens and newspapers. If only everybody knew the reality and could be spurred to action, the following would not come true....
Kinnell, Himmys going to need the smelling salts if he reads those contributions.
I'm used to seeing rampant racist rants in these threads.
Even if some of the worse offenders disappear, they return with renewed racist garbage, claiming to have personal experience, of course, to give their raging racism a supposed air of credibility.
As I said, personal anecdotes do not reflect reality, they are merely personal racist rant, and as such will be filtered through the orators hate-filled prejudice.
Mottie has kindly offered a manual on how anyone can maintain numerous usernames at the same time on here.
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I really, really wasn't interested in a discussion of how or why buildings fall into lack of use.
I simply asked if they should be subsidised to continue to exist, even if their use is no longer wanted?
The obvious, and only answer, that in the vast majority of cases they should be allowed to either fall into disrepair and be demolished, or they should be allowed to be modified to meet a genuine need of the community.
With the obvious exception of notable historic buildings, and pubs and churches, by and large, do not fall into that category.
Should have given yourself more time to come round Himmy surely that's not your best shot? You've done better diatribes than that.
As usual your comments are gobbledygook.
I have no idea what 'come round Himmy' is supposed to mean.
You're so obsessed and eaten up by your racism that you're incapable of explaining yourself coherently.
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Deleted member 174758
Sorry @andy11, but Christianity has lost a lot of its' relevance for many people below your age - and the rot set in in the 1920s and 1930s in the UK when in the aftermath of WWI people, quite rightly, began to resist the oppressive nature of the state religion in the UK (e.g the compulsory demands for tithes to be paid in many country districts, at the rate of 2/- in the pound or 10%, almost up until WWIi - only being abolished in 1936 after decades of campaigning). To the men who had been in the trenches it seemed like God had forsaken them, so why should they pay for his servants on earth to have a cushy life?
A more personal example: my old man went into the Navy in WWII and for a while ended up on convoy duty. Home on (fairly rare) leave he had the verger turn up demanding to know why he hadn't been to chuch! My father's response that there was a war on didn't seem to cut the mustard and a row ensued. He never went to church again for the rest of his life, even mmarrting in a registry office. It didn't stop his beliefs, but it killed his subordination to the church
It takes a culture shock for people to abandon religion. In Ireland it was revelations published in the 1990s about the Industrial Homes and orders such as the Christian Brotherhood which precipitated a move away from religion. To me this was very noticeable; I had lived and worked in Dublin in the late 1980s and early 1990s and as late as 1991 everyone went to church on Sunday - in 2001 when I was back over there for a year, it was most noticeable that very few people I worked with (mostly early 20s to late 40s) didn't go any more.
The plain fact is that religion has been used as an unelected powerbase throughout history to control people. Nothing more.
On the subject of Islam, as an avowed atheist they consider me to be an apostate, who can apparently be murdered without there being any sin attached to that act. For that reason alone I detest Islam, but I am careful to differentiate between Islam and Muslims. Someone else's religious beliefs should not come into your relationship with them unless the seek to impose their beliefs upon you. That would be brainwashing
In terms of the decline of pubs, we have seen a lot close over the last 30 odd years where I live. Some are now restaurants (two Italian restaurants within a few miles plus several Indian restaurants), but we've seen other conversions to offices, houses and flats (a lot of those because pubs tend to be large buildings). In the places where pubs have closed it is often because local industry has already closed (so few customers) or the pubs were too far out from settlements (drink drive laws, there), or they just weren't attractive enough (a lot of the pubs which closed round here were big dreary, dingy old places). From what I've seen in the middle of big cities like Manchester pubs are still pretty lively, but they have adapted to changing times.
There has also been a culture change since the 1970s - for example in the 70s lunchtime drinking was quite common whilst these days it is frowned on. In fact in my industry (construction) it is the norm to bar and send home anyone returning to work after a break who shows signs of intoxication. This is a safety issue, nothing more, and many workplaces have similar rules nowadays. But there has also been a move away from drinking after work, partly because people tend to live further away from work than they did in the past, and those drink drive laws. So there are other major factors at play which you aren't taking into consideration
A more personal example: my old man went into the Navy in WWII and for a while ended up on convoy duty. Home on (fairly rare) leave he had the verger turn up demanding to know why he hadn't been to chuch! My father's response that there was a war on didn't seem to cut the mustard and a row ensued. He never went to church again for the rest of his life, even mmarrting in a registry office. It didn't stop his beliefs, but it killed his subordination to the church
It takes a culture shock for people to abandon religion. In Ireland it was revelations published in the 1990s about the Industrial Homes and orders such as the Christian Brotherhood which precipitated a move away from religion. To me this was very noticeable; I had lived and worked in Dublin in the late 1980s and early 1990s and as late as 1991 everyone went to church on Sunday - in 2001 when I was back over there for a year, it was most noticeable that very few people I worked with (mostly early 20s to late 40s) didn't go any more.
The plain fact is that religion has been used as an unelected powerbase throughout history to control people. Nothing more.
On the subject of Islam, as an avowed atheist they consider me to be an apostate, who can apparently be murdered without there being any sin attached to that act. For that reason alone I detest Islam, but I am careful to differentiate between Islam and Muslims. Someone else's religious beliefs should not come into your relationship with them unless the seek to impose their beliefs upon you. That would be brainwashing
In terms of the decline of pubs, we have seen a lot close over the last 30 odd years where I live. Some are now restaurants (two Italian restaurants within a few miles plus several Indian restaurants), but we've seen other conversions to offices, houses and flats (a lot of those because pubs tend to be large buildings). In the places where pubs have closed it is often because local industry has already closed (so few customers) or the pubs were too far out from settlements (drink drive laws, there), or they just weren't attractive enough (a lot of the pubs which closed round here were big dreary, dingy old places). From what I've seen in the middle of big cities like Manchester pubs are still pretty lively, but they have adapted to changing times.
There has also been a culture change since the 1970s - for example in the 70s lunchtime drinking was quite common whilst these days it is frowned on. In fact in my industry (construction) it is the norm to bar and send home anyone returning to work after a break who shows signs of intoxication. This is a safety issue, nothing more, and many workplaces have similar rules nowadays. But there has also been a move away from drinking after work, partly because people tend to live further away from work than they did in the past, and those drink drive laws. So there are other major factors at play which you aren't taking into consideration
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Another one in the onion bag, so easily triggered.
Don't think you do irony do you Himmy, did you not read that last paragraph back to yourself before pressing the button.
Think you might have cause for reflection if you had in that, that's fu*cking horses*it what I've typed up there.
That's what I said, only with less swear words.
You weren't letting that go can't help yourself can you Himmy.
I think you've reached joke status now.
Been in touch with Charlie George since last night when he sent you packing?
That was one of them laugh out loud moments.
I think you've reached joke status now.
Been in touch with Charlie George since last night when he sent you packing?
That was one of them laugh out loud moments.
26 minutes and no reply. Methinks the nurses have got him back in his strait jacket
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Deleted member 18243
I do know about those factors. There are many others too but I just summarised the main reasons for pub closures; however they all boil down to government disfavour and its failure to protect things important to its voters.
The next thing to hit pubs will be the cost of covid rises in the prices of gas and electricity; these will render many pub businesses unviable, especially those ones in large buildings that you mentioned. Big pubs do seem a waste of space now, but it wasn't always so. The cliche about being a hub of the community was often true of many large pubs - all sorts of clubs and associations would meet in the upstairs rooms; bands would rehearse; wedding receptions and 21st parties would be held etc etc.
It's not all bad news, many new small bars have opened in recent years, usually in small shop units with low overheads. Most towns now have at least one thriving example of these. They are often not very pub-like and so are not to everyone's taste, but it shows that drinking culture is alive and well.
If a truly 'racist rant' had been posted on this forum i'm certain it would be removed by moderators.
In that case, do you think the moderators are implicit in this racism you seem to see here or are your standards of proof misguided?
Personal anecdotes reflect the observers reality and cannot be verified by a google search; so you either believe them or not.
When some posters persistently post up any bad publicity about foreigners, immigrants, etc, and at the same time fail to comment on exactly the same occurrences involving white people, that is blatant racially motivated fermenting of hatred against ethnic minorities.
That's racism. It might be heavily disguised as purporting to merely repost the news, but taken in comparison with their silence on similar events involving white people, it's still racism.
If the mods decide to allow it, and make no attempt to dissuade such fermenting of racial hatred, then yes, mods are complicit.
Moreover there have been numerous claims of me being other posters. I assume that these other posters also posted objections and counter arguments against this continuous stream of racism.
Now what happened to these other numerous posters? Why, if the allegations are true, was it necessary for these posters to keep returning again and again under new usernames?
No-one has offered any explanation for these questions, so far. Would you like to offer an explanation for why so many new usernames (allegedly) are necessary?
I can only assume that it is because these other posters were banned, time and time again, for objecting to and posting counter arguments against the continuous racism.
Now, if my assumption is correct, it suggests that not only that mods are complicit in allowing these persistent racist comments to remain, but proactively ban any counter arguments to assist the racist culture.
Now let's take into account ReganAndCarter's admission of publicly revealing personal data of someone on this site, and he's allowed to continue posting! One of the worst racists on here confesses to committing a crime, on this site, and he's allowed to continue posting.
Considering all these issues, it seems perfectly reasonable to me to consider that the mods are either supporting the fermenting of racial tensions via this site, or failing to suppress it in any way, and even surreptitiously banning those posters that argue against the racism displayed here.
Exactly what I said, we agree. Personal anecdotes reflect the reality as perceived by the observer.
Whether those anecdotes are true or not is of course a matter of conjecture.
I suspect it is not a rare occurrence that some may invent a personal anecdote trying to add an air of credibility to their bigoted perception.
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