Spot the (deliberate?) mistake

ericmark · 21 Nov 2014

The test lamp of course

never really worked out why these were so expensive?

He does seem to have something about knives.

It's not that long ago that testing was switching it on and seeing if it works.

But the heading is clearly wrong to do electrical work safely and correctly does not need those tools. To facilitate an electrical installation you may need those tool but not for the installation it's self.

The only tool which could be said to have anything to do with safety is the "Electricians" pliers which one would assume means insulated.

He has not even suggested insulated side cutters.

Little like the safety officer that said I must not use a Stanley knife but must use a craft knife instead. Wonder what he thought a Stanley Knife was? He wanted a Stanley Knife with a retractable blade.

I remember being given an electricians tool kit and it had a Facum tool screwdriver handle with a cup shaped grip at the end and a knurled screw to make it grip but not very strong. It took ages to work out what it was for. In the end turned out for fitting the retaining nut on lamp shades.

ban-all-sheds · 21 Nov 2014

ericmark said:
He does seem to have something about knives.

Photo from the book:

The only tool which could be said to have anything to do with safety is the "Electricians" pliers which one would assume means insulated.

I think he means something like this:

He has not even suggested insulated side cutters.

Or insulated screwdrivers.

ban-all-sheds · 21 Nov 2014

ericmark said:
But the heading is clearly wrong to do electrical work safely and correctly does not need those tools. To facilitate an electrical installation you may need those tool but not for the installation it's self.

It's a booked aimed at DIYers - I don't see how you can draw a fine distinction between "facilitating" an electrical installation and "the installation itself". I'm not even sure what distinction you see.

333rocky333 said:
Thats a similar kit to what I was supplied when i started as an apprentice, there was indeed more Carpentery tools than I deemed necessary, but I was doing more commercial than domestic.
These were a one off and your own responsibility to replace.
A lot of firms supplied a Basic kit back then.

Proper Test gear, like wind up meggers,etc were allocated from the office and signed for as needbe.
Most firms still do supply test gear.

But this is not a book aimed at apprentices - its target is the DIY market

The rear cover of the book:

I know that he does have a section on safe isolation, so he must cover the use of one, but I just think it's very odd that he doesn't have any form of voltage indicator in his kit list. Not even as an "other useful tool" - this is the page following that one (gone from Amazon now, but was in my browser cache)

But at least he doesn't have a neon screwdriver in there

ericmark · 21 Nov 2014

I see nothing wrong with a good quality neon screwdriver. I have on a number of occasions removed a neutral wire and it has become live due to a borrowed neutral. Also worked on a cable I thought was isolated in fact I had been told it was redundant, and as a motor auto turned on it became live. The proving dead procedure will not protect against this. I would agree we should use a clamp-on ammeter and we should also physically trace a cable, and if that is not possible spike the cable.

But anything which makes one aware of an error must be good. OK it's not a tester as such but a very good extra string to the bow when things go wrong.

JohnW2 · 21 Nov 2014

ban-all-sheds said:
Well, I'm showing you the page which has the kit list on, as that's the page containing a kit list which I believe is missing some essential items of kit.

I understand that. However, the pre-amble to that list seems to suggest that it's intended as a list of 'essential tools'. It could be that the author did not consider test equipment to be 'tools', and that there therefore might be a corresponding list of 'essential test equipment' in the 'testing' chapter/section I mentioned. Unless someone buys the book, or the pages in question become available on-line 'at random', I suppose we'll never know!

Kind Regards, John

bernardgreen · 21 Nov 2014

The book may be "readable" via google books ( books.google.com )

NewOrder · 21 Nov 2014

When I read that the first thing that came to mind was no mention of test equipment! When was it written 1925?

Grenage · 21 Nov 2014

EFLImpudence said:
A haphazard and random use of commas.

To be fair, the commas are used correctly; the sentences should have been restructured to avoid necessity.

JohnW2 · 21 Nov 2014

joydivision said:
When I read that the first thing that came to mind was no mention of test equipment! When was it written 1925?

Indeed - but as I recently wrote, that appeared to be a list of 'essential tools' (albeit including a few 'quaint'/'dated' items!), and the author may not have regarded test equipment as being 'tools'. As I said, there is a section on 'testing' which is at least 15 pages long, which includes such topics as continuity, IR,. EFLI and RCD testing (clearly not '1925'!) and it would not surprise me if that section also includes a list of 'essential test equipment'. There is even a photo of a meter being used on the front cover.

Kind Regards, John

jeds · 21 Nov 2014

Reminds me of when I used to do a lot of work with my brother in law years ago. (he was a spark) He used to keep an old book in his tool bag - The Readers Digest Book of Electrics, or something like that. It was falling to pieces with half the pages missing, bits of old canvass tape holding it together and the contents was old round pin stuff. If anybody ever queried anything to do with his work he used to get the book out, page through it in front of them - usually shaking his head - and then say; no, can't see anything about that in the book, it must be OK. The looks on their faces was priceless.

JohnW2 · 21 Nov 2014

jeds said:
Reminds me of when I used to do a lot of work with my brother in law years ago. (he was a spark) He used to keep an old book in his tool bag - The Readers Digest Book of Electrics, or something like that. It was falling to pieces with half the pages missing, bits of old canvass tape holding it together and the contents was old round pin stuff. ...

Despite the references to "wheel braces" etc., the book to which BAS is referring was actually published in October 2012.

Kind Regards, John

ban-all-sheds · 21 Nov 2014

Well, if it will fit between them, a hand operated brace is a good tool to use with an augur to make holes in joists - I'm sure we've all had the fun, particularly with nice new sharp bits, of it either driving itself through so fast that you get damage when it breaks through, or having it jam. Yes - you might have a drill with a torque limiter, or with speed control, but that doesn't mean that a brace is passé.

JohnW2 · 21 Nov 2014

ban-all-sheds said:
Well, if it will fit between them, a hand operated brace is a good tool to use with an augur to make holes in joists - I'm sure we've all had the fun, particularly with nice new sharp bits, of it either driving itself through so fast that you get damage when it breaks through, or having it jam. Yes - you might have a drill with a torque limiter, or with speed control, but that doesn't mean that a brace is passé.

Well, that would be the 'wood brace' in the list and, despite the potential advantages to which you refer, any 'normal' one (maybe they made 'mini' ones!) would never fit between joists, so one would have to drill the hole at a significant angle. As for the 'wheel brace' ('Hand drill') to which I referred, although I have several knocking around, it must be many years since I've used one! I doubt that many current-day electricians carry either of these tools around with them

Kind Regards, John

EFLImpudence · 21 Nov 2014

Grenage said:
EFLImpudence said:

A haphazard and random use of commas.

Click to expand...

To be fair, the commas are used correctly; the sentences should have been restructured to avoid necessity.

Nope.

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EFLImpudence
21 Nov 2014
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ban-all-sheds · 21 Nov 2014

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Spot the (deliberate?) mistake

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