Woman and Sex, means biological sex.

[Highway Man]

That has never been a subject of discussion between us.
If you think that we have been discussing that, you're deluding yourself.

Well I must dash, would love to say it has been a blast but I would be lying. It was dull and boring. Still I will sleep well tonight. Good night.

 

[morqthana]

its whats known as inclusion, it's just words.

And my, didn't you get bent out of shape about the words casting doubt on your self-declared military history...

I am not doubting there are those that think they are something other than male or female, sadly the law states otherwise.

You're not sad at all - you, just like all the other haters and bigots, are delighted, because you think your bigotry is now scientifically justified.

It isn't, of course, but people like you have never been good at joined up thinking.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

but I would be lying.

Not for the first time, obviously, because you have accused me of admitting that I am ignorant of the subject matter, when I never such a thing.
But I accept it was your poor understanding of my comments.

'night.

 

[Highway Man]

And my, didn't you get bent out of shape about the words casting doubt on your self-declared military history...

Not really, I don't like to be told I am lying over something that I hold close to me. Nothing unusual there really. Bent out of shape? I hadn't noticed if I was. Bizzare accusation. Still if that is what you think, I cannot help you out with that.

 

[Highway Man]

I really must go to bed now as I feel as though I will fall asleep before I reach the bedroom, no offence intended but I am rather bored with you pair.

 

[morqthana]

I am merely quoting the law, you pointed to an equality act of 2010. It is now 2025 and the law states that a trans woman is not legaly a female. It's just how it is whatever you seem to think. Look it up

In his verbal summary, Lord Hodge said: “The Equality Act 2010 gives transgender people protection, not only against discrimination through the protected characteristic of gender reassignment, but also against direct discrimination, indirect discrimination and harassment in substance in their acquired gender”.

Within the ruling itself the judges state: “A man who identifies as a woman who is treated less favourably because of the protected characteristic of gender reassignment will be able to claim on that basis.

“A man who identifies as a woman who is treated less favourably not because of being trans (the protected characteristic of gender reassignment) but because of being perceived as being a woman will be able to claim for direct sex discrimination on that basis.”

Former Supreme Court judge Jonathan Sumption has warned that organisations are potentially misinterpreting the landmark ruling that defined women by biology earlier this week.

Lord Sumption told BBC Radio 4’s PM programme that, contrary to much of the commentary on the Supreme Court ruling, judges did not take a side and did not provide an obligation to create single sex spaces.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

You're not sad at all - you, just like all the other haters and bigots, are delighted, because you think your bigotry is now scientifically justified.

It isn't, of course, but people like you have never been good at joined up thinking.

The scientific and medical world often throws the legislators a curve ball.

There is growing recognition that the binary (male/female) assignment of sex at birth is an oversimplification and may not accurately reflect the full spectrum of human experience. This is supported by advancements in scientific understanding, increasing social awareness of gender diversity, and the evolving legal recognition of non-binary identities.

In this perspective article we discuss the limitations of sex as a binary concept and how it is challenged by medical developments and a better understanding of gender diversity.

Is sex still binary? - PMC

In this perspective article we discuss the limitations of sex as a binary concept and how it is challenged by medical developments and a better understanding of gender diversity. Recent data indicate that sex is not a simple binary classification ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Assigned sex is the label given at birth by medical professionals based on an individual’s chromosomes, hormone levels, sex organs, and secondary sex characteristics. As a note, the term “biologic sex” is understood by many to be an outdated term, due to its longstanding history of being used to invalidate the authenticity of trans identities. Although sex is typically misconceptualized as a binary of male (XY) or female (XX), many other chromosomal arrangements, inherent variations in gene expression patterns, and hormone levels exist. Intersex categorizations include variations in chromosomes present, external genitalia, gonads (testes or ovaries), hormone production, hormone responsiveness, and internal reproductive organs. Medical classification of intersex individuals is not always done at birth, as many intersex traits do not become apparent until puberty or later in life.

The Inclusion of Sex and Gender Beyond the Binary in Toxicology - PMC

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Advertisers have begun to acknowledge that an increasing number of consumers do not support the traditional gender binary, believing that gender is dynamic and lies on a continuum.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00913367.2022.2109780

But highwayman wants to hold us all to ransom until we accept his outdated and bigoted opinion.

 

[morqthana]

Not really, I don't like to be told I am lying over something that I hold close to me.

So it's not always "just words" then.

Anyway, you're lying about science saying that there are only two sexes. Whether you hold that falsehood close to you I do not know.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

There is a common perception amongst those who have given it little thought, that gender is a social construct, whilst biological sex is solid and rigid and fixed and binary and scientific. Those who wish to attack and marginalise trans girls like my daughter, like to argue that her biological sex is male, as though that is a scientific fact.

They are wrong.
To unpick this we need to tackle several different issues.


A social construct is when we put artificial boundaries around groupings that are really more complex and messy. Biological sex is certainly a social construct.

Biological Sex is a social construct

I recently tweeted, as an aside, that biological sex is a social construct, and the backlash and attacks were swift, incredulous and heavily reliant upon very basic biology. There is a common perce…

growinguptransgender.com

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Biological sex is complex, messy, overlapping. There is a ton of evidence of this, and only someone with Trumpian levels of ignorance can attempt to deny this.

The term ‘biological sex’ is outdated and needs to be thrown out, along with other outdated concepts that we as a society have ditched. There have been numerous historical parallels, where other areas of complex variation were overly simplified and fixed, usually to enable those with more power to use rigid categories as a way of policing and controlling those with less power (rigid class and race categorisations spring to mind).

A binary understanding of biological sex is a simplification that causes harm to those for whom the multiple components and processes contributing to sex differentiation do not all neatly align. This includes people who are intersex and trans people.

Being trans is not a choice, there is a biological underpinning of being transgender.

We can find a way to live within a complex messy world of biological diversity whilst providing dignity and respect to those who are in a minority.

Biological Sex is a social construct

I recently tweeted, as an aside, that biological sex is a social construct, and the backlash and attacks were swift, incredulous and heavily reliant upon very basic biology. There is a common perce…

growinguptransgender.com

 

[morqthana]

Biological Sex is a social construct

I recently tweeted, as an aside, that biological sex is a social construct, and the backlash and attacks were swift, incredulous and heavily reliant upon very basic biology. There is a common perce…

growinguptransgender.com

That was very interesting - looks like I might have to stop being so sure that "sex and gender are not congruent".

Sadly those here who could do the most with reading it are the ones most likely to refuse to. Or whine that it's "too long" for their little brains to cope with.

A couple of excellent quotes from it:

You can make a political decision to ignore and disenfranchise and abuse minorities like intersex or transgender people. But you do not get to claim that your political decision is underpinned by science.

The people clinging to ‘biological sex’ have the understanding of and respect for science of President Trump. They have similar levels of respect for minorities.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

That was very interesting - looks like I might have to stop being so sure that "sex and gender are not congruent".

Sadly those here who could do the most with reading it are the ones most likely to refuse to. Or whine that it's "too long" for their little brains to cope with.

A couple of excellent quotes from it:

You can make a political decision to ignore and disenfranchise and abuse minorities like intersex or transgender people. But you do not get to claim that your political decision is underpinned by science.

The people clinging to ‘biological sex’ have the understanding of and respect for science of President Trump. They have similar levels of respect for minorities.

Yes I thought the article not only had some very pertinent comments, but was written from a personal and well-informed perspective..
As I said earlier, science and medicine frequently throws legislators curve balls. They have the unenviable task of applying ill-thought out parliamentary decisions to reality.
A couple of other examples I can think of is that suicide was illegal. How will they prosecute successful suicides?
Then there's assisted dying and how the courts have to negotiate a fair, just and empathetic approach.

The recent SC ruling might open the floodgates for pressure on the government to reassess the situation, not only because their ruling has been misinterpreted as overruling scientific fact, but also seemingly legitimised discrimination.

Trans people are seeking asylum abroad amid fears for their safety after last week's Supreme Court judgment, a Labour peer has claimed.

Access Restricted

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[Odds]

A couple of other examples I can think of is that suicide was illegal. How will they prosecute successful suicides?

Perhaps in the same way CharlesII dealt with Cromwell and his fellow regicides?

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Perhaps in the same way CharlesII dealt with Cromwell and his fellow regicides?

By exhuming their bodies and publicly 'executing' them? That'll teach 'em.

 

[johnny2007]

You are not the brightest person I have encountered, just another nutjob trying to act clever, but that is all it is, an act and nothing more. I suggest that you try giving some credible evidence or some sort of argument to back you up in the future. Hopefully you will have learned something tonight, for example, do not link to some HR policy of inclusion and expect to prove a point. I will wish you a good night as I have work in the morning and no doubt you have a bus to catch.

You clearly have not had the pleased to meet Himmy.
Wait until he starts extracting words out of your posts to match his own narrative.