Boiler installer left old flue hole open

[Peter Rabbit]

Hi, I recently had a gas boiler replaced in a 2nd floor flat. In discussions with the company afterwards, I found out that they had to drill a new flue hole (I wasn't there when the work was being done - it didn't seem like they would have taken the initiative to tell me!). This hadn't been planned - the possibility that this would be necessary hadn't been discussed beforehand. From the outside, the old flue hole appears open (see image) - they've not told me yet if there was any sealing done on the inside. The hole is covered over by the boiler, so it can't be seen from the inside. The cupboard where the boiler was installed is a tight space with only just enough clearance, which is why I think the position of the flue needed to be changed to fit the new boiler. I'm also going to have to discuss this with my freeholder, as I think their permission would normally be needed beforehand for changing a flue hole.

I was wondering is it acceptable for the old flue hole to have been left like this? And is it reasonable for the installers not to have raised beforehand that the need to move the flue hole was a possibility given the amount of available space, given there is not generally freedom to drill through external walls in a leasehold flat? Is it urgent to get the hole repaired, or is it not a big deal if it's left like this for a few weeks? Does anyone here know what would be the most cost-effective approach to getting the hole repaired?

Thanks very much to anyone who can help.

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Not acceptable at all, leaves Cavity open to ingress of Birds, Wasps, Bees, anything in fact that takes a fancy to making a home in there, never mind the weather.

Have an idea the new Flue needs to be sealed externally as well, but hopefully one of the Gas Safe Guys can confirm that.

 

[CountryFan]

Have an idea the new Flue needs to be sealed externally as well, but hopefully one of the Gas Safe Guys can confirm that.

Yes it does because it's an opening in the building, so similar to an air vent, most mi's I've read state 300mm away, which that clearly isn't. There’s no sealing around the outside if the flue and no weather collar.

Also the flue could be considered too close to the eaves and eaves ventilation and possibly the window, but that may be ok. A lot depends on the manufacturer of the boiler, perhaps @fyj can confirm this?

 

[Peter Rabbit]

Yes it does because it's an opening in the building, so similar to an air vent, most mi's I've read state 300mm away, which that clearly isn't. There’s no sealing around the outside if the flue and no weather collar.

Also the flue could be considered too close to the eaves and eaves ventilation and possibly the window, but that may be ok. A lot depends on the manufacturer of the boiler, perhaps @fyj can confirm this?

Thanks. Do you mean it currently doesn't appear compliant with regulations if the new flue isn't sealed? What does it need to be 300mm away from?

The new boiler is a Vaillant Ecofit.

 

[CountryFan]

Do you mean it currently doesn't appear compliant with regulations if the new flue isn't sealed?

If it’s not sealed inside or out, then no it doesn’t. Should be sealed to the building fabric, but mi’s will stipulate what they want.

What does it need to be 300mm away from?

Any opening to the building, such as an air vent, ventilation, holes et al. The flue should be 25mm away, might be more from the soffits, again would be in the mi’s.

 

[Peter Rabbit]

Thanks. Sorry but just to check, what are "mi's"? Manufacturer's instructions?

 

[Peter Rabbit]

If it’s not sealed inside or out, then no it doesn’t. Should be sealed to the building fabric, but mi’s will stipulate what they want.

If it's sealed on the inside alone, would it be compliant with regulations then? Does it only need to be sealed on the outside if the "mi's" say so?

 

[CountryFan]

Thanks. Sorry but just to check, what are "mi's"? Manufacturer's instructions?

Sorry should have said, yes manufacturers instructions

If it's sealed on the inside alone, would it be compliant with regulations then? Does it only need to be sealed on the outside if the "mi's" say so?

I can't remember tbh, there was a gas safe technical bulletin regarding being sealed to the building fabric. I'll try and find out. It should have a weather collar though and still doesn't negate the fact of the hole.

 

[CountryFan]

If it's sealed on the inside alone, would it be compliant with regulations then? Does it only need to be sealed on the outside if the "mi's" say so?

Screenshot taken from the mi's, steps 2 and 4 should answer this

 

[gas112]

what is the white pipe sticking out the wall is this from the boiler ?

 

[Peter Rabbit]

Screenshot taken from the mi's, steps 2 and 4 should answer this

Thanks. Which model is that for? I looked up the instructions for the ecoFIT pure 825-835 (not sure if this corresponds to the boiler I had installed - I only know its an ecoFIT 25kW) here and it doesn't seem to mention sealing the flue on the outside (for the flue set up on p.12). So I wonder if it varies between models. Just thought I should clarify before challenging the installers about it. Is it normally a good idea to get the edge of the hole around the flue sealed even if the manufacturer's instructions don't explicitly say to do it?

what is the white pipe sticking out the wall is this from the boiler ?

I presume it's the new flue. Though someone with more expertise may know better!

 

[fixitflav]

I presume it's the new flue. Though someone with more expertise may know better!

I think he means the small white pipe lower down to the right. That might be the condensate outlet pipe, repositioned from the hole 2 bricks' length away to the left. If so, I doubt if it's acceptable.

Edit - looking at the pic more closely, the thing to the left could be the outlet from a pressure relief valve. The old boiler may have been non-condensing

 

[CountryFan]

Thanks. Which model is that for? I looked up the instructions for the ecoFIT pure 825-835 (not sure if this corresponds to the boiler I had installed - I only know its an ecoFIT 25kW) here and it doesn't seem to mention sealing the flue on the outside (for the flue set up on p.12). So I wonder if it varies between models. Just thought I should clarify before challenging the installers about it. Is it normally a good idea to get the edge of the hole around the flue sealed even if the manufacturer's instructions don't explicitly say to do it?


I presume it's the new flue. Though someone with more expertise may know better!

Several Vaillant boilers including the ecofit

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I was wondering is it acceptable for the old flue hole to have been left like this?

No! It looks as if the installer, only had access from the inside, so did all the work from inside, completely ignoring the outside finishing. Perhaps the intention is to return later, to complete the job?

Drop a tape measure down, from the lower edge of that Velux, to the flue pipe. It is required to measure greater than 300mm distant.

Check that new white pipe out, it looks as if it is probably a condensate drain. If so, it shouldn't be left like that, discharging into the air.

 

[gas112]

I presume it's the new flue. Though someone with more expertise may know better!

im on about the pipe at bottom right not the flue