Woman and Sex, means biological sex.

[diy_fun_uk]

We need to be very careful about oppressing people just because a minority of them are bad. In the southern USA one of the grounds they used to justify segregation was that black men would rape white women if they were allowed to share spaces.

Black people are naturally black.

 

[morqthana]

Well, it was a problem for some nurses, in the north-east I think it was, who had a female-identifying man in their changing room, who had a girlfriend and they were trying for a baby! He leered at them and asked when they were going to get undressed. They complained to their union man and he said it wasn't a problem, they must live with it. They finished up getting changed in a store cupboard.

We need to see what the investigation establishes is the truth about the behaviour. But in the meantime it is worth reading this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Concern#Ideology_and_issues about the organisation which is "supporting" the nurses.

I think I'm on safe grounds saying that the truth is probably more nuanced than the way the situation has been presented by the media.

Are nurses special people who never have an anti-trans bias? No.

Was the situation badly handled by management? No surprise there if it was.

 

[blup]

Irrespective of anything to do with trans rights that should never be allowed. We do not live in a theocracy.

It’s not unreasonable to provide female only swimming sessions

Is it though?

1) Men do get, and die from, breast cancer. Rare it may be, but it claims the lives of 85 men annually in the UK.

2) I'm not ascribing transgenderism to any hormonal/genetic causes, but is it not possible? Is it not possible that hormone treatments for men transitioning to women could increase the risk of getting breast cancer? I don't know, but I can see how it could be the case.

3) What medical expertise do you have which qualifies you to say it's mad?

The medical evidence that there are different rates of breast cancer between women and biological men

If fairness was the only criterion, then we'd need to compare the prevalence of trans women prisoners attacking cis prisoners with that of trans women in male prisons being attacked.

Why? The prison service took the view that they were providing a discriminatory service because only biological women were allowed in the prison. There was no objective proportionate justification for this so they let a convicted biological male rap ist transfer as s trans woman. The law presumed (or was interpreted to mean) that only her rights were being breached, not the female prisoners rights to be protected. That is mad and unfair. The assumption that there is no difference between biological sex and chosen gender is dangerous and wrong.

All prisons are violent places, they contain a lot of violent people. I expect there's violence in women's prisons.

Are the numbers of trans prisoners seeking to be held in a different sex prison too high for proper risk assessments to be done? If someone is violent before they announce that they are trans I would have thought that they'd be just as violent afterwards.


IMO a male prisoner simply declaring that he now identifies as a woman is nowhere near enough.

The fact that men may be under threat from other men in an all male prison does not justify sending them to a female prison on the basis of a flawed comparison.

 

[JohnD]

I'm not trolling on about anything - just trying to shut down the argument used by transphobic people that their position of denial is based on sex being binary.

It is foolish and incorrect to pretend that people who say a man cannot change into a woman by saying "I am a woman" is transphobic.

 

[JohnD]

So despite all that you have ever read or heard, you still think that some people are trying to declare themselves to be a different sex.

Yes, some people do that.

I do not believe that you are unaware of that fact.

You are just throwing out deliberate attempts at dishonest diversion.

 

[morqthana]

It is foolish and incorrect to pretend that people who say a man cannot change into a woman by saying "I am a woman" is transphobic.

You will take care, won't you, not to say "man" when you mean "male".

You will take care, won't you, not to say "male" when you mean "man".

You will take care, won't you, not to say "woman" when you mean "female".

You will take care, won't you, not to say "female" when you mean "woman".

 

[JohnD]

I repeat.

A man cannot change into a woman by saying "I am a woman."

There is no need for you to pretend you do not understand me.

 

[Highway Man]

I repeat.

A man cannot change into a woman by saying "I am a woman."

There is no need for you to pretend you do not understand me.

Not so sure about that, morqthana is showing potential.

​

 

[morqthana]

It’s not unreasonable to provide female only swimming sessions

It is totally unreasonable if they are wanted for religious reasons. By definition, religious beliefs have no reason attached to them.

The medical evidence that there are different rates of breast cancer between women and biological men

Please provide the medical evidence showing that the treatments for transitioning men do not increase their risk of breast cancer.

Please provide the medical evidence showing that trans women do not have a higher risk of breast cancer than cis men,

Why? The prison service took the view that they were providing a discriminatory service because only biological women were allowed in the prison. There was no objective proportionate justification for this so they let a convicted biological male rap ist transfer as s trans woman. The law presumed (or was interpreted to mean) that only her rights were being breached, not the female prisoners rights to be protected. That is mad and unfair. The assumption that there is no difference between biological sex and chosen gender is dangerous and wrong.

"took the view" ... "no objective proportionate justification" ... "was interpreted to mean" ...

You seem to think that people not doing something properly means that the something should no longer be done.

I tend to the view that it's the "not doing it properly" which should be addressed.

The fact that men may be under threat from other men in an all male prison does not justify sending them to a female prison on the basis of a flawed comparison.

But you don't do that.

You do it on the basis of a proper risk assessment, and robust criteria for determining if a transition is real.

You seem to think that people not doing something properly means that the something should no longer be done.

I tend to the view that it's the "not doing it properly" which should be addressed.[/quote][/QUOTE]

 

[morqthana]

I repeat.

A man cannot change into a woman by saying "I am a woman."

A male cannot change into a female by saying "I am a female".

That does not mean that a man cannot change into a woman.

There is no need for you to pretend you do not understand me.

But it seems you have every need to pretend that "man" and "male" are synonymous.

It seems you have every need to pretend that "woman" and "female" are synonymous.

It seems you have every need to pretend that gender and sex are synonymous.

 

[morqthana]

Look at any pride rally to see that trans is an illness. Just watch them in the rally. How sick their acts are. Its all in the head. Its not normal at all::

View attachment 379606

That's it - you pretend that anything you don't like, or don't understand, or causes you confusion, or indeed in any way conflicts with the cosy fictional reality you have constructed within your brain, which does not have the capacity to deal with contradictory facts, is an illness.

 

[JohnD]

It seems you have every need to pretend that gender and sex are synonymous.

Wrong.

I have often said that sex is a biological fact.

In current usage, people say "gender" to mean a feeling, an opinion, or a whim.

If you want to say you feel like you are a kitten, that's a feeling, an opinion or a whim. It's not a fact.

We all know that you aren't really one.

 

[morqthana]

Yes, I did actually. It may take a few days, but it's boy or girl.

Does that include the cases where surgery is used to change physical characteristics and drug therapies are used to change chemical processes inside the body, to result in a baby which then passes all the tests required for it to be whatever sex they decided it should be made into?

 

[morqthana]

In current usage, people say "gender" to mean a feeling, an opinion, or a whim.

If you want to say you feel like you are a kitten, that's a feeling, an opinion or a whim. It's not a fact.

You've contradicted yourself there.

If gender is a feeling, an opinion, or a whim, then changing it is exactly what someone can do.

 

[morqthana]

Black people are naturally black.

And...?