What a wast of money and court time.
Just cut them off after 2 letters if they can't be bothered to write back or pick up the phone.
And charge them for the extra cost.
Just cut them off after 2 letters if they can't be bothered to write back or pick up the phone.
And charge them for the extra cost.
J
johnfox
thanks for replys,i now see both sides of the issue.
would the disconnecting engineer need the meter qualfication to cap/disc the meter.
aglie,just answer the technical questions.good lad.
would the disconnecting engineer need the meter qualfication to cap/disc the meter.
aglie,just answer the technical questions.good lad.
The basic gas qualification covers capping off gas supplies, putting a disc in a meter or removing a meter.
Rather oddly, there is a seperate qualification for meter changers, so it could be argued that the basic qualification does not cover fitting new meters. Even though it covers removing a meter and refitting the same meter back later.
Tony
Rather oddly, there is a seperate qualification for meter changers, so it could be argued that the basic qualification does not cover fitting new meters. Even though it covers removing a meter and refitting the same meter back later.
Tony
J
johnfox
good answer,thanks.
A landlord (LA, HA or private) is not entitled to disconnect the tenant just because the annual serice has not been done.
The requirement for the annual service is a completely separate issue to the tenants right to "quiet enjoyment" of the property - which means that the landlord can not interfere with the property in any way without the tenants permision or a Court Order.
There can be no presumation that the failure to carry out a service renders the installation dangerous.
The landlord must use the courts to gain access to carry out the annual service or disconnection - for which he must prove that disconnection is warranted.
A landlord who unlawfully disconnects the gas, has commited a trespass, has breached s.11 of the L&T Act 1985, will most likely have commited an offence under the EPA 1990, and will be liable to pay compensation to the tenant for diminishing the tenancy
EDIT:
I've written "service", but read this as "annual safety check". I call them services, which is basically what they are.
The requirement for the annual service is a completely separate issue to the tenants right to "quiet enjoyment" of the property - which means that the landlord can not interfere with the property in any way without the tenants permision or a Court Order.
There can be no presumation that the failure to carry out a service renders the installation dangerous.
The landlord must use the courts to gain access to carry out the annual service or disconnection - for which he must prove that disconnection is warranted.
A landlord who unlawfully disconnects the gas, has commited a trespass, has breached s.11 of the L&T Act 1985, will most likely have commited an offence under the EPA 1990, and will be liable to pay compensation to the tenant for diminishing the tenancy
EDIT:
I've written "service", but read this as "annual safety check". I call them services, which is basically what they are.
N
namsag
Ours goes to court to gain right of entry then chippy ,fitter and council officer turn up, pretty certain they bill the tenant for costs.
Used to send eviction notices which really pis@ed the mayor and deputy off when they got one
Used to send eviction notices which really pis@ed the mayor and deputy off when they got one
That all sounds very impressive but unfortunately misses the point!
The salient point is that the Landlord has a legal obligation to carry out a gas safety check and have the appropriate Certificate issued every 12 months under the Gas Safety and Use regulations 1999.
Thats a totally different matter from routine servicing which is not specifically required by law unless written into the agreement. Although a persistent failure of the landlord to have the appliances serviced could amount to the landlord not maintaining the property adequately.
In any case most tenancy agreements contain a clause allowing the landlord a right of entry at all reasonable times after giving prior notice in order to inspect and carry out any maintenance required.
Tony
The salient point is that the Landlord has a legal obligation to carry out a gas safety check and have the appropriate Certificate issued every 12 months under the Gas Safety and Use regulations 1999.
Thats a totally different matter from routine servicing which is not specifically required by law unless written into the agreement. Although a persistent failure of the landlord to have the appliances serviced could amount to the landlord not maintaining the property adequately.
In any case most tenancy agreements contain a clause allowing the landlord a right of entry at all reasonable times after giving prior notice in order to inspect and carry out any maintenance required.
Tony
You have absolutely no idea what you are on about.
I suggest before you start giving advice, you consider whether or not you have any knowledge about the subject.
I don't know what exactly you do for a living, but reading and understanding does not seem to be a part of it.
A compulsory gas SAFETY inspection has nothing to do with a service, but is to ensure the.... SAFETY!
I have carried out plenty, and found many defects, often so bad that I had to call the emergency services out for immediate disconnection.
Failure to inspect and ensure safety is a breach of gas related legislation and a criminal offense.
Surely if you were a real building surveyor, you would know this.
Checking that the flat is empty and clean after the council tenants move out, is not really the same as being a surveyor.
The right is implied within the L&T Act, but the tenant is entitled to refuse entry, in which case the landlord must apply to a Court to enforce its right of entry.
Basically, the landlord can not just give notice, turn up and enter - or just carry out the work if access is available externally. Landlords have no power of entry.
The landlords legal obligation to carry out an annual check/service does not give him any powers of entry, and does not give him rights to take any action if access is not gained - other than apply to the court for access in order to carry out his legal obligation to carry out the check.
I would not agree with you IF there is a clause in the tenancy agreement granting the landlord rights of entry to carry out the landlord's obligations.
Nor would I agree that the tenant can repeatedly refuse entry without good reason in that case apart from the obvious case of work or hospital appointments. The landlord would have to arrange access at a " reasonable" time to suit the tenant. Thats not always easy with a difficult tenant who works night shifts and sleeps during the day!
Tony
More nonsense from a useless civic.
Every RGI has a legal duty to ensure gas-safety, and is obliged to take reasonable action to make safe any gas defects. The same goes for landlords.
Any unsafe gas system has to be at least turned off and possibly disconnected or capped off.
Disconnecting an unsafe gas installation from outside the property, with contact details how to get it re-connected after reasonable attempts have been made to gain access, is a perfectly acceptable way of ensuring safety.
No court in this country has ever convicted a landlord for following this procedure.
Prosecutions for failing to ensure gas safety are numerous.
The main reason councils get sued successfully so often, is that they employ clueless fools like yourself.
Benjamin
Don't let your arrogance cloud the facts.
Let's just hope you know more about soldering than you do about L&T issues.
The rights and obligations under a Tenancy Agreement are unrelated to those under the GSR regs.
The lawful procedure is as I stated above
Don't let your arrogance cloud the facts.
Let's just hope you know more about soldering than you do about L&T issues.
The rights and obligations under a Tenancy Agreement are unrelated to those under the GSR regs.
The lawful procedure is as I stated above
woody you post from Birmingham so i'm not sure whether english councils have different agreements or not, but certainly in scotland the council and HA's have no qualms about forcing access to cap gas or capping it externally, i personally have been involved in organising engineers to do hundreds of them over the years, the tenant has a care of duty to neighbours etc so to not allow access for a safety check in a flat with OF appliances is considered negligent and could be dangerous so the HA's take the view that it is better to upset one numpty family to protect the rest of the block, it is well documented at tenants evenings and in newsletters that is is done for the greater good and all decent tenants don't have a problem, you will find the ones who don't let access generally have something to hide, i have heard all the excuses under the sun from them about not being able to arrange access for our engineers and when i say fine it is up to you but we will visit on the 10th with police and HA officer and will force the door you usually find a lot of them miraculously have a half day on wednesday, the toerags who don't work and don't care get the door crashed or external meter capped, their prob, i have never been sued yet and have done several hundred.
The tenancy Agreement is a contract, and any breaches must be pursued via the civil courts.
Yes, the landlord will always win such a claim, as the tenancy agreement may impose additional conditions above those contained in the L&T Act. Costs will be claimable from the tenant
Rest assured I know a lot more about gas issues than about l&t issues, my knowledge of the latter is limited to the essentials; contrary to your own knowledge, which is generally very limited.
That is why I have my own business, and you work for the council.
Some of the essentials are:
Tenants MUST allow entrance after reasonable requests for access.
Landlord MUST ensure safety of tenants.
Landlord MUST ensure safety of neighbours is not diminished by tenants.
Disconnecting gas from OUTSIDE does not constitute trespass.
The legal procedure to get entry, when SAFETY IS NOT AN ISSUE is as above.
Like the average muppet employed by the council, you completely fail to
to realise the essentials here.
You do not need access to a flat to disconnect an outside meter.
By continuously refusing reasonable access requests, the tenant is in breach of the tenancy agreement.
By continuously refusing reasonable access requests, the tenant is actively endangering himself, the neighbours, and property.
What you call: gsr regs, are actually called: gsiu regs; just another example of your lack of knowledge.
And the gsiur are most certainly related to tenancy agreements, as they clearly state that the tenant is held to keep the property safe and and in reasonable state.
I forgot the exact text, but it comes down to: "treat the place as if it were your own."
Not allowing compulsory inspection and necessary maintenance, is not keeping it in a reasonable state, let alone keeping it safe.
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